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  #121 (permalink)  
Old 10-11-2007, 07:28 PM
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well i will be the first to admit there are many on here who know more than i do so here is my question . on the areas you can see put can't really get into too clean super good but you can see surface rust(inside quarters etc.) what do you recommend

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  #122 (permalink)  
Old 10-13-2007, 11:05 AM
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someone? anyone?
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  #123 (permalink)  
Old 10-13-2007, 10:16 PM
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If all we are talking about is surface rust with no pits that go all the way through all you really need to do is seal the surface from oxygen and moisture to stop any further rust. I would get it as claen as I could and then use some paint product to seal the surface. You have several choices, there is Eastwood's Rust Encapsulator, POR-15 or my preference which is Epoxy primer. I have used the Rust Encapsulator and was not thrilled with the adhesion, epoxy primer has about the best adhesion you will find and will seal the surface, other primers will not. If you can't get in with a spray gun then use a brush or a rag or a sponge on stick, whatever it takes to get a full coating slopped on in those areas. Rust is a chemical reaction, remove any of the required components (in this case oxygen) and the reaction stops.
If you have pits that go all the way through then the rust will continue from the back side, this is why people say "rust never sleeps". In fact rust can sleep just like Rip van-Winkle you just need to cut off the oxygen.
Have fun with your project.
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  #124 (permalink)  
Old 10-14-2007, 05:50 AM
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39, I agree with you I would sand off the rust and use epoxy. I know home grown tests don't mean much so I have said little about it but after reading so many opinions about how to deal with rust here a couple of years ago I decided to find out for myself. The test was to paint some lightly rusted pieces with POR 15, epoxy, and epoxy top coated with paint. What I found is that the POR does indeed seem to stop the rust and keep it from getting worse BUT so does the epoxy! It's been over two years now and the rust does not seem to be a problem however adhesion is another story, the POR will scrape off fairly easily although it is VERY hard and scratch resistant. The epoxy does much better in this respect (adhesion) but the side exposed to the sun has faded or "chalked" somewhat (Omni 170 epoxy) while the shaded side still looks good. About the same happened to the POR panel except I took it down and placed it in the shade long ago because it is not supposed to be exposed to the sun so I did not want to ruin the results. Bottom line is POR seems to work as advertised but epoxy seems to work just as good without the adhesion and other problems of the POR 15. This is a very crude test that may or may NOT mean anything but it sure SEEMS to me that epoxy is the better choice.
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  #125 (permalink)  
Old 10-14-2007, 09:51 PM
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I'm using Coca~Cola and a wire brush on a rotary tool to clean up some ....well alot.... of rusty tools that I got a yesterday.....let them soak then wire brush Soaked and cleaned about 100 sockets today and have about another hundred soaking now.....just using oil and wire brush for the ratchets etc.
Shane
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  #126 (permalink)  
Old 10-15-2007, 06:58 AM
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Chevy, Coke may work a little bit but the only reason it does anything at all is because of the phosphoric acid it contains which is a VERY weak solution. Go get yourself some Navel jelly, Ospho or any of the other Phosphoric acid based products and you will save yourself a heck of a lot of work because they are a MUCH stronger solution of the same chemical. As I said Coke may work a little bit on really small parts that can soak overnight but nowhere near as good as one of the real rust removers and it would be useless for removing rust on body panels.
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  #127 (permalink)  
Old 10-22-2007, 09:49 PM
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Yeah the coke is a weak solution....but if I spill it on me no worries and i dont have to use gloves but I do agree that for body panels it wouldn't be very useful...but for taking a little rust off of chrome It's awesome. 275 sockets cleaned so far(been busy and slacked a little bit) cleaned some of the other tools too but I still have a pile to go
Shane
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  #128 (permalink)  
Old 10-23-2007, 08:38 AM
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It may very well be that Coke could be a better choice for something like chrome sockets because I would think a strong Phosphoric acid solution might cause problems with chrome, especially if it is slightly damaged allowing the acid to reach the metal underneath. I have a couple of old sockets so I think I will toss them into some Ospho and leave them overnight to see what happens.
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  #129 (permalink)  
Old 10-29-2007, 09:47 AM
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When

Quote:
Originally Posted by BarryK
I don't understand!

We have one of a very few top notch leaders in his field here trying to teach us something (and he is, me anyway)
and were clogging this up with wily cars and acids and I'm sure next some one will tell him to por it and be done with it.

There are 100's of threads here covering all that stuff, so can we keep this one clean and on subject.

Were lucky a guy like this is doing what he is as you don't see Boyd on here trying to teach anyone anything!

If I offended anyone I am not sorry and feel free to blast me with a PM, just keep this thread clean.
Hi Barry
I don't know how he can be so good. All I see is him sleeping on his monster E wheel. If that is all he does I think a cot would be a lot cheaper
Just kidding. He is a great guy. I had the pleasure of meeting him at his place when he held the 04 metalmeet.
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  #130 (permalink)  
Old 11-01-2007, 05:05 PM
 
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This is a great thread and I appreciate all the knowledge thatís being shared here.

Question, when working in areas which cannot be accessed by a wire wheel, sand paper or scuff pad, is it wise to use the Navel Jelly? To be specific, the hard top on my International Scout has seems which are inaccessible. So thereís no way to see if thereís a build up of rust, which Iím sure there is some, and to remove it. Should I use the Navel Jelly in areas I canít see or access? Might I be worsening the problem?

Secondly, Should one be using epoxy paint as a top coat for metal? Not epoxy primer but actual epoxy paint. Again, thanks.
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  #131 (permalink)  
Old 12-29-2007, 05:53 PM
 
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Hey all. Just want to say this is a great thread. It has helped me out tremendously. My car is coming along great.

But, I have a question regarding body filler and the naval jelly.

I don't know if all body fillers are the same but I had decided to use All-Metal. It is an aluminum based filler.

Do I need to worry about the All-Metal filler absorbing the jelly and ruining my final paint like other fillers??

Any input would be greatly appreciated.
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  #132 (permalink)  
Old 12-29-2007, 07:02 PM
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39Hemi i think rust is caused by the flow of electrons.

You can seal the area, you can provide a sacrificial anode, or you can use the cars body as a storage capacitor for a oversupply of electrons needed for sacrifice.

Ive seen vehicle anode + electronic rust preventive systems but theyre not all the same and im not drilling holes for anodes all over the place.

The following site has some good info on the latest technology.

http://www.couplertec.com.au/
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  #133 (permalink)  
Old 12-30-2007, 03:21 AM
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All-Metal is good stuff, we used to use it on airplanes in Alaska to fill dents in the airplane skin before paint. My gut tells me to use it like Bondo and Epoxy the metal first, then put the All-Metal on top, but it sure seems like a lot of guys do it the old-fashioned way and throw it right on the bare metal. Good choice of filler though...
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  #134 (permalink)  
Old 12-30-2007, 01:30 PM
 
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Yeah, I have been debating cleaning all the All-Metal off of the welded areas and starting new. Clean all the rust, epoxy, and then start over.
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  #135 (permalink)  
Old 02-15-2008, 11:00 AM
 

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secrets of rust removal revealed

Hi all, I have been searching this thread and others for info about something rust related. I want to remove the rust from my '56 f-100 frame. So I put a flapper disc on my grinder and went at it. Under the rust is a black substance that sticks to the flapper disc making the disc useless in a matter of minutes. Is this black stuff some kind of sealer the factory or what ?

Last edited by flyinv55; 02-15-2008 at 11:27 AM. Reason: '56.. not '57
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