I want to convert my falcon`s front brakes to disk. i have heard that you can use xf falcon parts? does anyone know any more about this? i also wouldn`t mind getting a chrysler centura diff as i hear these are a close fit.. and already ford stud pattern..?
1964 ford falcon xm
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disc brake Falcon
Falcons came out with disc brakes in 67, as optional equipment. My parts interchange book shows a different part number for the spindles in 66-67, however the 66-68 disc and drum brake vehicles used the same spindle. The only thing I could recommend would be to compare those spindles to your stock units. It may well be that they use the same ball joints etc and the only difference is the spindle itself compared to yours. If thats the case, the later spindle would be a bolt in replacement.
You will also need to change over to a dual reservoir master cylinder as well. Unless you want to convert your intire brake system over to one specific year vehicle, I would also recommend getting a brake proportioning valve, so you can correct any possible braking differences from front to rear. First get your brakes put on then take for a short test drive and see if you have any problems with either the front or rear brakes over braking while the other end doesnt brake at all. If this is the situation, then you will want to put an adjustable brake proportioner on the line of the brakes that are doing all the braking. This will allow you to reduce the pressure on that set of brakes and allow the other set to work. These come with a knob on them so you actually have infinite adjustment to control front/rear brake bias.
Since your Falcon already has most likely an 8 inch Ford Rear end, why would you want to go to the headache of putting another style rear end in the vehicle? The easy way to tell what rear end you have is to look at the housing. If it has a cover on the back end, rather than a pumpkin like a 9 inch, then you might consider a swap, but I would recommend staying with the Ford rear at any case. They arent the most saught after rear ends for no reason.
You didnt mention what engine you have in your Falcon. Or the year of Falcon.
One more thing, does your Falcon have 4 or 5 lug wheels?
Falcons came out with disc brakes in 67, as optional equipment. My parts interchange book shows a different part number for the spindles in 66-67, however the 66-68 disc and drum brake vehicles used the same spindle. The only thing I could recommend would be to compare those spindles to your stock units. It may well be that they use the same ball joints etc and the only difference is the spindle itself compared to yours. If thats the case, the later spindle would be a bolt in replacement.
You will also need to change over to a dual reservoir master cylinder as well. Unless you want to convert your intire brake system over to one specific year vehicle, I would also recommend getting a brake proportioning valve, so you can correct any possible braking differences from front to rear. First get your brakes put on then take for a short test drive and see if you have any problems with either the front or rear brakes over braking while the other end doesnt brake at all. If this is the situation, then you will want to put an adjustable brake proportioner on the line of the brakes that are doing all the braking. This will allow you to reduce the pressure on that set of brakes and allow the other set to work. These come with a knob on them so you actually have infinite adjustment to control front/rear brake bias.
Since your Falcon already has most likely an 8 inch Ford Rear end, why would you want to go to the headache of putting another style rear end in the vehicle? The easy way to tell what rear end you have is to look at the housing. If it has a cover on the back end, rather than a pumpkin like a 9 inch, then you might consider a swap, but I would recommend staying with the Ford rear at any case. They arent the most saught after rear ends for no reason.
You didnt mention what engine you have in your Falcon. Or the year of Falcon.
One more thing, does your Falcon have 4 or 5 lug wheels?
64 falcon brakes
Thank`s for your reply! very informative. the falcon is 1964 XM Sedan with 141ci 6 cyl and three speed man coloum shift. it has four stud wheels which is one reason i want to change the rear end as well. once i get all the brakes and body sorted (this will take time as cash is an issue) i intend to replace the engine and box as i would like a 5 speed and a bit of power. im thinking crossflow possibly injected. i am a mechanic so i will do most of the work. i am just gathering as much information as possible while i get some bills out of the way...you know how it is ha ha
Thank`s for your reply! very informative. the falcon is 1964 XM Sedan with 141ci 6 cyl and three speed man coloum shift. it has four stud wheels which is one reason i want to change the rear end as well. once i get all the brakes and body sorted (this will take time as cash is an issue) i intend to replace the engine and box as i would like a 5 speed and a bit of power. im thinking crossflow possibly injected. i am a mechanic so i will do most of the work. i am just gathering as much information as possible while i get some bills out of the way...you know how it is ha ha
64 Falcon
I am rather curious about the cross flow head. Have heard of it but havent seen any good pix or gotten much detail on it here in the US. I presume it has the intake on one side and exhaust on the other. Is it most similar to a Winsor head or Cleveland?
I am rather curious about the cross flow head. Have heard of it but havent seen any good pix or gotten much detail on it here in the US. I presume it has the intake on one side and exhaust on the other. Is it most similar to a Winsor head or Cleveland?
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17 Posts
I think that the brakes from a 70-73 mustang, 74-77 MAverick/comet, and a 75-80 Granada/monarch should all work on a falcon, but I could be wrong
Shaun
Shaun
64 Falcon
An 8 or 9 inch rear end out of a 64-73 Mustang would probably bolt right into your Falcon, as they all used basically the same floor pan, and if I remember correctly, a lot of parts like differentials etc were used commonly by both the Falcon, Comet, Mustang, and Cougar of the 60's. I do recall that in 69 or 70, the Falcon here in the US was upgraded to a cheap body model Fairlane, so I am not sure about that time period. My parts interchange book is showing a myriad of differentials for 64-69 Falcons, Mustangs, Comets, and Cougars, and none of them seem to show the same numbers, but that doesnt mean anything either. About the only thing I could recommend is get a tape measure, and measure the distance between your backing plates and also the distance between your spring perches. With a book that has more detail than mine, you could probably find what you are looking for. My bet would be to go with the 8 inch rear end, as they arent as popular for hot rodding stuff as the 9 inch, but they are underestimated, and will take a lot of abuse. Ive even seen them behind stoutly built 460's.
The Granada was a common user of the 8 inch as well.
An 8 or 9 inch rear end out of a 64-73 Mustang would probably bolt right into your Falcon, as they all used basically the same floor pan, and if I remember correctly, a lot of parts like differentials etc were used commonly by both the Falcon, Comet, Mustang, and Cougar of the 60's. I do recall that in 69 or 70, the Falcon here in the US was upgraded to a cheap body model Fairlane, so I am not sure about that time period. My parts interchange book is showing a myriad of differentials for 64-69 Falcons, Mustangs, Comets, and Cougars, and none of them seem to show the same numbers, but that doesnt mean anything either. About the only thing I could recommend is get a tape measure, and measure the distance between your backing plates and also the distance between your spring perches. With a book that has more detail than mine, you could probably find what you are looking for. My bet would be to go with the 8 inch rear end, as they arent as popular for hot rodding stuff as the 9 inch, but they are underestimated, and will take a lot of abuse. Ive even seen them behind stoutly built 460's.
The Granada was a common user of the 8 inch as well.
You are not talking about the Australian Falcon,are you?
64 Falcon
The Falcon in discussion does happen to be in Australia, but back at that time, the only difference between an Aussie Falcon and an American version, was essentially the Aussies had the steering wheel mounted on the wrong side of the car.
The Falcon in discussion does happen to be in Australia, but back at that time, the only difference between an Aussie Falcon and an American version, was essentially the Aussies had the steering wheel mounted on the wrong side of the car.
Ok Max.I thought so.Then it must be a pre Mad Max Falcon which I think is a magnificent design.I watched Mad Max 1 eight times back then and could not tell if the whellbase on the car was Mustang or Torino.Do you know? Paulo
64 Falcon
From the looks of the body, barring all the Roo gaurds etc, it appears to be a 69 or 70 Mustang.
From the looks of the body, barring all the Roo gaurds etc, it appears to be a 69 or 70 Mustang.
the crossflow i speak of is a later 6 cyl engine 4.1L which ran with a cast iron head untill about 1986 when they introduced an alloy crossflow head. and a few years later they injected it.
Thanks to maverick i will keep an eye out but these could be hard to find as im down under..
And the car in mad max is an xb falcon coupe 1974-5 based off the 4 door aussie built falcon. The 1978 version won bathurst (the biggest touring car race we have,1000 klm set on a large mountain) with a dealer team 1-2 finish.. not bad! and i am a holden fan!! (thats GM down under)
Thanks to maverick i will keep an eye out but these could be hard to find as im down under..
And the car in mad max is an xb falcon coupe 1974-5 based off the 4 door aussie built falcon. The 1978 version won bathurst (the biggest touring car race we have,1000 klm set on a large mountain) with a dealer team 1-2 finish.. not bad! and i am a holden fan!! (thats GM down under)
Ok Aussie.
The cars on your side of the planet are quite interesting.The Monaro should be about the same size as a Falcon,I assume.I had the rare opportunity of having someone visiting New Zealand and bring me 2 hot rod magazines.I was impressed by the intake manifold design on the Holden V8.Can you say more about that?
The cars on your side of the planet are quite interesting.The Monaro should be about the same size as a Falcon,I assume.I had the rare opportunity of having someone visiting New Zealand and bring me 2 hot rod magazines.I was impressed by the intake manifold design on the Holden V8.Can you say more about that?
Joined
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110 Posts
xm rear end change
Rob from Adelaide Hills here,
If you use the Centura diff you will find it is a close fit. I put one in with a mate in the eighties and used the chrysler steel wheels off a charger so we could get the centre offset right. I think we had to massage the inside of the wheelwell to allow clearance. Custom wheels from dragway would fix that problem as they will make to order. Good luck!
Rob from Adelaide Hills here,
If you use the Centura diff you will find it is a close fit. I put one in with a mate in the eighties and used the chrysler steel wheels off a charger so we could get the centre offset right. I think we had to massage the inside of the wheelwell to allow clearance. Custom wheels from dragway would fix that problem as they will make to order. Good luck!
hi Paulo you are correct the monaro and falcon coupes of the time wre of similar size and both based off the sedan. but if you speak of the late model monaro.. (also based from family sedan) i think the basic shell design was from chev anyway..? well when this shape came out (1989-90) they introduced a new v6 engine with it (this is the buick 3.8 ltr also from the u.s.) so any way back to the 308 holden 5.0 L this also has a smaller brother a 253 ci 4.2 L these were introduced in about 69-70 (i think) and upgraded through the years.. in about 1979-80 they dropped the 253 the 308 got fuel injection in 1990 (to fit with the new model) and improved air flow due to the large valve and well opened up cylinder heads and they finally got the water jacket wall thickness right with the block.. so to sum up the 1990 holden 308 known as vn as that was the prefix for the commodore (the family sedan) holden dropped the 308 about 2000-01 and decided to go back the best chev small block. (we used these in the early days befoure we made our own v8... we really should`nt have botherd. seeing as we are now back where we started. all hail the mouse.. anyway i hope i didnt bore you..?
And thanks rob. i can get a centura housing from a mate free. sweet...
And thanks rob. i can get a centura housing from a mate free. sweet...
Ok Falc.Good information.We rarely get to learn about these other cars.Here in Brasil the only rear wheel drive car sold by Chevrolet is an Australian Holden re-badged as Chevy Omega.It is equipped with this 3.8 ltr V6.Must be the 90 degree block with offset crankshaft and even fire.
Now the old Monaro,was it the Police Interceptor car in Mad Max 1?
Paulo
Now the old Monaro,was it the Police Interceptor car in Mad Max 1?
Paulo
paulo: the yellow red and blue sedan persuit car is the falcon sedan stock, other than a paint job lights and so forth. the front end on max`s coupe was never sold.. not stock anyhow. the front of the stock coupe is the same as the sedan. there is however a holden monaro in the movie.. (i havent seen it for a very long time..) so i am not sure who drives it but it it the more attractive(i am a holden fan at heart.. largely to do with the chev connection..) curvy large black coupe.
the chev/holden you speak of having there uses the buick desigined engine as it does in aust? i assume. we call it a commodore. the first commodore body design originated from opel (we had to re-work suspension and front panels) our roads were just to rough for the original suspension.. and the engines not strong enough 4cyl i thnk? we fitted 6 cyl up to 3.3L and the 4.2+5.0L v8`s. the model you got i am sure (at least the floor pan) was from gm in the us. now we sell the coupe back to them with the 5.7L chev fitted and theysell it as a pontiac gto. it hasent rated highly because to get it past our emmissions reg`s gmh HAD TO (?) detune it somewhat.
ok hope i havent bored you too much..
the chev/holden you speak of having there uses the buick desigined engine as it does in aust? i assume. we call it a commodore. the first commodore body design originated from opel (we had to re-work suspension and front panels) our roads were just to rough for the original suspension.. and the engines not strong enough 4cyl i thnk? we fitted 6 cyl up to 3.3L and the 4.2+5.0L v8`s. the model you got i am sure (at least the floor pan) was from gm in the us. now we sell the coupe back to them with the 5.7L chev fitted and theysell it as a pontiac gto. it hasent rated highly because to get it past our emmissions reg`s gmh HAD TO (?) detune it somewhat.
ok hope i havent bored you too much..
Ok Falc. Ok,then it must be a Holden Monaro,the black weird car driven by Knight Rider with a lousy ***** next to him.The scene was not too long and the car was being pushed bumper to bumper by this Falcon sedan at top speed! Then the Police Interceptor notices an accident up ahead and slows down.Knight Rider slams on the brake pedal,barefooted - and you can read DEATH tattooed on his toes - looses control of the Monaro,crashes and explodes.From that point on his bikers gang start to chase Max and the other Police men.I wonder if this was the Holden used at the heydays of Bathurst against the Falcon.Was the Australian Charger also a competitor back then?
And yes the Australian built Holden sold here in Brazil as a Chevy Omega has the 3.8 V6.I am sure it is not an American platform.It has independent rear suspension.The platform should be the same as the new GTO.In the 90s they were sold with a German 3.0L OHC straight 6 or a 250 pushrod straight 6.
And yes the Australian built Holden sold here in Brazil as a Chevy Omega has the 3.8 V6.I am sure it is not an American platform.It has independent rear suspension.The platform should be the same as the new GTO.In the 90s they were sold with a German 3.0L OHC straight 6 or a 250 pushrod straight 6.
Joined
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110 Posts
Front discs on your XM
You can use the later XD XF spindles and brakes as they do go right on to your balljoints but the steering tie rod end tapers are different, I think you can still get the adapters from Adrian Seelenmeyer conversions but I don't have his address anymore. Another way is to get a machine shop to make up an adapter to use the XD outer and the XM inner if you are using the original steering box get an engineer to check them out before you pay out to make them and they will be okayed by transport
If you put the crossflow in you will find that the sump fouls on the steering, easy fix is to make up 6mm spacers and pop them under the engine mount bolt on the engine, you then will need to adapt the car to the new transmission and I think Castlemaine Rod Shop has a kit for 5 speeds.
The new generation Monaro was designed in England (sorry) but the good news is that Holden Special Vehicles is selling them back to the poms as a Vauxhall VX with 370 ponies under hood.
Hope the info helps.
You can use the later XD XF spindles and brakes as they do go right on to your balljoints but the steering tie rod end tapers are different, I think you can still get the adapters from Adrian Seelenmeyer conversions but I don't have his address anymore. Another way is to get a machine shop to make up an adapter to use the XD outer and the XM inner if you are using the original steering box get an engineer to check them out before you pay out to make them and they will be okayed by transport
If you put the crossflow in you will find that the sump fouls on the steering, easy fix is to make up 6mm spacers and pop them under the engine mount bolt on the engine, you then will need to adapt the car to the new transmission and I think Castlemaine Rod Shop has a kit for 5 speeds.
The new generation Monaro was designed in England (sorry) but the good news is that Holden Special Vehicles is selling them back to the poms as a Vauxhall VX with 370 ponies under hood.
Hope the info helps.
thank you rob for the info, a great help!do you know of a steering box conversion? i will try to look up adrian. thanks again.
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