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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi, im a 16 year old putting a chevy 350 into a 67 mustang. Now before you all go off about putting a chevy in a mustang, I bought the mustang with no engine and got a really good deal on the engine and tranny. I rebuilt the engine myself but when we went to put the engine in, it just wouldn't fit. Any ideas what I could do to make it fit?
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Won’t fit how?

As in length, width, height, Chevy uses a rear sump pan Ford needs a front sump, Exhaust manifolds don’t clear the spring towers. You know details like that.

As swaps into pony cars go putting a GM engine into a Ford is more difficult than a Ford into a GM body. The devil is in the details and there are a lot of details. This includes potential body modifications as typically the Mustang gets into cutting the front spring towers to get clearance, this of course is structure and requires the welding of plates to restore the needed strength.

This is a tough swap to do requiring a lot of fabrication and welding skills. Since your modifying primary structure your life will depend on these skills.

Bogie
The oil pan is hitting the lower bar in front of the steering colum bar, im going to get rid of the metal fan, I kind of have a small list of what I need to do, but some more help would be great. I dont have the manifolds on right now because I am just testing the fit so I need to see how its going to fit. I also need to create a custom motor mount (I took welding in school so I kinda know what to do a little). I was told by a local mechanic that I should come on here. I might also need to get a custom oil pan to fit.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Having worked on a couple of FE-powered 67-70 Mustangs, I was thinking exactly the same thing. ;)

I had one friend who had a 69 Mustang that he had dropped a 427 side oiler into. He liked to tell the story that the only way to get headers in the car was to remove the heads, drop the headers alongside the block, bolt the headers to the (loose) heads, and THEN bolt the heads to the block.
would that be the easiest way to put it in? Might as well start research now, you know? so you have to disassemble the whole top just to put it in the car?
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Just research "1967 Mustang FE engine install" or "swap"(the 390 is part of the "FE" engine family of big blocks).
It's a really tight fit, even with stock exhaust manifolds. Changing spark plugs is a pain-in-the-ash. Header fit is challenging.

If you want an easy swap, 5.0L/302" small block, or a 331or 347" stroker using the 302 block is an easy, buy the parts and drop it in deal.
A 351Windsor makes a nice swap candidate, or a stroker built on a 351W block, header fit is a little tighter.
Then there is the 351C, or a 351W with Cleveland type heads(called a "Cleavor"), its do-able, most all the parts are available but header fit gets tighter yet.

Then it's a pretty big jump in physical size to the 390FE....and weight. Fe is among the heaviest of big blocks.

Was your car originally a inline6 cylinder, or a V8 small block 289?
It was originally a v8 smallblock 289
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Frankly, unless you plan to do serious mods to the FE, your power-to-weight will probably be better with the small block. The FE looks impressive, but it's 1950s technology.
I hear ya, I thought it over and did some research and im just going to make the 350 fit. I put months into the rebuild. So anything that will help with the fit that I need to know? (schools starting next monday so all this will be after school)
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
If this was my build in today’s world and given your ‘stand had a 289, I’d belly up to the bar and take a later model 302 with a 347 kit in it.
Sadly I don't have a 289 available. Besides I really love the chevy 350's reliability and power. Also the time and money ive put into this id love to see it in the stang.
 

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Discussion Starter · #24 · (Edited)
This pan is probably your best bet at getting the SBC to fit the Ford steering linkage.


Aluminum head’s and intake plus an aluminum coolant pump will get the engine weight down to that of a Windsor block Ford. This will keep you out of suspension and brake mods to accommodate the heavier Chevy engine. You’ll have to fabricate adapters for the engine mounts, taking a play from S10 swaps the GM 60 degree V6 mounts may work to clear the cross member yet keep the engine low as possible in the body.

You're likely to have to fabricate headers, the Ford steering box location competes with space making the drivers side a real pain. The other headache is the rear mount Chevy distributor, that’s going to say a lot regarding positioning the engine for service space of the distributor.

There are adapters to connect the Chevy engine to the Ford transmission. Chances are pretty good that the driveshaft length will need adjusting. Changining to a Chevy transmission will get into spline diameter and count issues so keeping the Ford gear box saves that pain. if a stick you just run a Ford disk in a Chevy clutch.

Bogie
the car came with some new springs to put on the car, so all i would need for the suspension is the shock absorber. I do have the chevy transmission and I can fabricate some of the parts like the engine mount adapter. The headers should be no problem at all (I do have the original chevy headers to use/ cut up.) The mounts that came with the car are 69 chevy v8 mounts. Do you think those would work?
 

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Discussion Starter · #26 ·
You’re arriving at the cut and try details, given this is off the experience list of those of us that responded, your cutting fresh trail.

When I talked about the small block Ford into my 80 Monza it was a pleasant surprise how easy it was just using a 4x4 pan and fitting a Ford radiator. It was close to a bolt in. Going the other way Chevy into Ford is going to be harder as the exhaust has to compete with space used for steering where Ford into Chevy that’s not a problem. And I used the GM trasnmission which was a Saginaw 4 speed from behind the original V6 with some beefing up that worked fine and this relieved having to rework tranny mounts and drive shaft. In your case the rear mount distributor of the Chevy is going to determine where the engine sits. That might force an adaption to where the rear trans mount has to be located which wi’ll affect the drive shaft length which is also going to require some adaption for the Chevy transmission slip yoke and whatever mods are required to adapt the drive shaft to the Chevy U-joint.

Up front you’ll need to find a Chevy radiator that fits or comes to a reasonable enough fit with some mounting mods because the pump inlet and coolant return are reversed sides compared to Ford.

You’ll find some aftermarket support which may be useful check out this link:

Bogid
so what your saying is I need to make a mount that will 1. support the engine while connecting it to the car (kinda like weld a removable plate) then with the metal fan off, try to find a radiator that would fit into the car, and 2. figure out a fan solution? The mustang did come with an original radiator do you think that would work? My dad and I are investing in an engine lift because we dont have one (we had access to a backhoe to put it on the stand) also, with the exhaust, would it be better to try to drop it out the front rather then in the back? like kinda in front/behind the tire. I know it would be kinda loud and it would be basically a straight pipe but that might be an easier solution rather then having to deal with the space problem
 

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Discussion Starter · #28 ·
Well I love the idea and the fact that it will piss off so many people, but the big question is when do you want to drive this car? And I am all for you learning how to hack wack and weld.

You have been given great advice on here from probably a 150+ years of experience in hot rodding,I know you have rebuilt the engine and what to see it run and have a car you want to drive. There are a few ways to carry this out but struggling to take on this type of challenge, will definitely teach you many things. Things about yourself, how to curse, and how to weld, fab, and engineer things.

I have to ask, have you looked to see if there is someone in need of a SBC? Maybe someone has a sbf that will trade you? Maybe someone has Camaro but wants a Mustang sounds like a good trade.

seeing your back in school there will be a lot of things that come up and have forbid you start dating, that can suck up a lot of time, unless you start dating a gear head that likes hot rodding.

I myself would find SBF and go have fun
Ok, so I took a welding and fab class the past 2 years so I have that, I basically grew up with a tool in my hand, and I am not really into dating atm. As for the camero thing, I have friends that would love to see this thing rolling down the street. Ive been doing some thinking and I kinda know what would be a good Idea.

1. take my metal fan blade off (more frontal clearance)
2. drop the exhaust right behind/in front of the front tire so I dont have to deal with those exhaust problems
3. custom fabricate some sbc 350 to 69 v8 mounts (they fit the same as the 67 mounts) and weld some support
4. I need to bring the engine forward and lean it back a lil so i have some more clearance (and maybe a tiny bit up for the oil pan clearance)
Also, im doing this to piss of my older brother who said it will never work, Lol
 

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Discussion Starter · #33 ·
I think we’ve given you enough technical detail to get well started. Load up on 2x4’s, 1x4’s and some carpenter shims and wedges. You can use this wood for cribbing to get your set ups and angles figured out. The cool way would be to buy a plastic dummy mock-up engine but they are pretty pricy so your going to have to use the old techniques of cribbing the setup to get your final dimensions for mounts, clearances, etc.

Bogie
Ok, right now the prices on wood is kind up there but my dad and I just talked ab it and we have a good solution. I believe what we can do is get all the measurements from the engine while its suspended above the car, and get those dimensions along with the engine mount stencil and see if the fabrication people at my school would be happy to fabricate some engine mounts. I was thinking since we have to bring the engine forward we could probable weld a support for the front of the engine mount, like a removable one. Of course I would have to talk to the teacher first, and also look at metal prices but its a good possibility. (They build trailers in class so it would be a good project.)
 

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Discussion Starter · #36 ·
Screw it 350, th425, rear engine beast.
Break out the tape measure
Yea, it shouldn't take too long to measure it out while its hanging above the car. Just have to find an engine hoist and partner with my dad to pay for it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #38 ·
If you’re nitpicking the cost of an engine crane you might as well quit while you’re ahead!
it will be the lowest cost item in your fantasy build.
you can find them cheaper than this one.
Near me I found a $200 one that is a good quality one. This "fantasy build" will become a reality build thanks to my teachers, friends and family. If I sounded mean saying this then sorry, cause i don't mean to. Talking to my teacher he told me I can come after school and fabricate the parts I need. Thanks for the link though.
 

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Discussion Starter · #40 ·
An engine hoist is something that if you ask around someone may let you borrow it for a few days.

Just make sure your using it on a level surface and keep it as low as possible minimizing anything below the actual thing your lifting.

Removing the front clip may make things easier. But depending on the rust may be a job in itself. If leaving the front clip a engine leveler can be used to help guide the thing in.

As far as the engine measurment goes. Get a piece of cardboard and make a template using the back of the block tracing around the block and heads.
Measure the width of the oil pan (not adding any sump) and width of the intake.
Now you can make this out of cardboard. But a sheet of plywood, some wood glue, and some wood screws will give you a lightweight mock up block that wont deform like cardboard eventually will.
They sell these things. But you can also make one for around $30(not including the cost of a skill saw) and some time out of plywood.
Once you have your plywood mockup block you can get the lets say 20 pound thing into the engine bay and see where things like the sump will need to be or what simply won't work.
This will give you a close estimate without moving around or getting your paws under a 700lb engine.

3/8" plywood lets you do things like screw on headers or engine mounts (using washers) to mock those up also.
This wont be perfect. But if you take your measurments a few times it has the potential to be very close.

Then when you have most of it figured out using the lightweight mock up block you can lift up that heavy engine.
As for the engine hoist, my brothers and I will use it a lot otherwise we wouldnt be buying it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #42 ·
I think we’ve given you enough technical detail to get well started. Load up on 2x4’s, 1x4’s and some carpenter shims and wedges. You can use this wood for cribbing to get your set ups and angles figured out. The cool way would be to buy a plastic dummy mock-up engine but they are pretty pricy so your going to have to use the old techniques of cribbing the setup to get your final dimensions for mounts, clearances, etc.

Bogie
thanks for all the help, ive given it some thought and im just going to bite the bullet and drive 2 hours away to get an original mustang 289. Might aswell, and most likely going to put some performance parts on the thing, but again. Thanks for all the help man.
 

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Discussion Starter · #44 ·
WAAAY back in 1968 ( when I was 16 ), I knew a guy a couple years older, who put a Chevy 327 built to 365 HP, in a 65 Mustang.. Same block as a 350.. It had a 4 speed and was the fastest car in the county. So I know this can be done. It may take a year working on it after school, but you'll be thrilled with the results.
Yea, but right now i'm just going to find a 289. I love the results I would get but i just don't feel like I can do it. A 289 is really my best option. And besides. The I wont be getting beat by both chevy and ford guys about the 350 in the mustang as well as I can put some edelbrock parts on the 289 to make it more powerful than the stock engine was. I'm also going to put a performance exhaust on it and I don't want to have to mix and match parts off a 350 performance exhaust and a 289 exhaust. It'll also make it easier to get a wiring harness so I don't have to adapt a wiring harness. Someday I hope to get a 350 and drop it in another car but right now I'm going to sell the 350. What do you think would be a good price for it? I was thinking somewhere near 4000 because it does have some performance parts and I did rebuild it. It would have the transmission as well
 

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Discussion Starter · #45 ·
Yea, but right now i'm just going to find a 289. I love the results I would get but i just don't feel like I can do it. A 289 is really my best option. And besides. The I wont be getting beat by both chevy and ford guys about the 350 in the mustang as well as I can put some edelbrock parts on the 289 to make it more powerful than the stock engine was. I'm also going to put a performance exhaust on it and I don't want to have to mix and match parts off a 350 performance exhaust and a 289 exhaust. It'll also make it easier to get a wiring harness so I don't have to adapt a wiring harness. Someday I hope to get a 350 and drop it in another car but right now I'm going to sell the 350. What do you think would be a good price for it? I was thinking somewhere near 4000 because it does have some performance parts and I did rebuild it. It would have the transmission as well
and If I did do it I could do the welding after school but i would have to adapt a lot of the mounts. I am buying a 68 mustang that was wrecked to use the parts off of it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #47 ·
You should be able to sell the 350 and trans to recoup what you've put into it. If it had an automatic, look for a C4 transmission to fit with no modifications needed.. Also a word of caution: the converter ALWAYS goes on the transmission first before installing. Use a straight edge and a ruler to make sure the converter is seated completely onto the transmission input shaft. A few years ago, I rebuilt a 727 transmission for a friend and painstakingly seated the converter and retained it with a couple of straps, only to have a shade tree mechanic take the converter off and bolt it to the flexplate first. Totally fried the transmission. The shade tree guy told my friend that he always installs them that way.. It was most likely his first, or he had destroyed transmissions.
Ive only put about 6-700 into this engine tbh. The engine for 300 and tranny for 200. + the rebuild kit for bout 125 and the oil pump and what-not. So if I sold for 4k then I would have a lot more money then I put into it. Thanks for the info bout the tranny btw
 

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Discussion Starter · #51 ·
FWIW the 289, the 302, and the 351 Windsor are all based on the same small block Ford. Any would fit without modifications. The 351 Cleveland and 351M are bigger engines. If you can find a 351 Windsor you can expect better power and torque than with a 289.
Ill look for one. My brother , strongly, discouraged me from the 351 windsor for some reason
 
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