[Mad_Max]

Got a buddy of mine that has small bumps on the hood and trunk of his Chevelle. They are very small, not like typical rust bubbles. Car was painted back in the mid 80's, with Ditzler Kondar primer and DBU base/clear.
They are so small they are nearly impossible to photograph clearly. They didnt appear until a couple years ago. Anybody hear of issues with Kondar or DBU?

 

[mike the painter]

oil or /and water in air supply......their speed bumps ...slow down :mwink: strip it off...redo imp: not a paint problem ...filter problem

 

[BarryK]

Another bodyman sent this to me and wanted me to reply, so will make an exception, so you know what is going on.

Kondar= have not herd that name in a while but it was one of the best primers in the 80's, many of painters said they would stop painting before giving up that primer. Only problem with primer is it was a lacquer primer.

Here is what is happening, the primer is breaking down and if you sand the little pinheads to metal you will see minor pitting of rust where each of these pimples are, the rusting is causing a gassing effect.

Usually this happens on the top surfaces first and then will show up as they work their way down the side of the car.

Anywhere there is the kondar on the car at this point, the problem has already started the above process and it will not be long before more show up, depending on sun time exposure.

No need to look a gift horse in the mouth as the owner has went a lot longer then normal before problem showed up, so that tells me this is a weekend driver and has not seen sun very much as this can happen under base coat inside of two to three years if driven daily.

Stripping is the only way at this point and even if you have good panels, the sanding and re-coating of those panels will accelerate BIG TIME the deterioration of the existing paint and could blow up first day in sun after a repaint.

What I'm trying to say is nothing was done wrong and this is just a life cycle of a lacquer primer, well if this primer was a human it lived to a 120 years old.

 

[Mad_Max]

So BarryK,

If I'm following you, you mean that stripping the entire car is the only way to go because if he tries to sand and repaint the affected areas it may just happen again?

Thanks for all responses.

 

[BarryK]

No, worse!

Be this is caused by perhaps acid etch primer (lacquer) under the Kondar, factory lacquer under the Kondar or the Kondar itself, bottom line is the paint job is toast.

Yes even a fender that still looks good at this point when you sand and repaint, good chance that fender will blow up after in sun a short time later.

Example:
A couple of years ago a real good restro shop called me, the customer had a 69 black firebird with either 3000-4000 miles on it, that he had parked in the basement since new.
Factory lacquer, I think we would all agree but had two ping dings he wanted fixed and then a black base and clear over it to go to the southern rod run.
The paint was perfect the shop owner said when he called and I told him he must strip to be safe.

Car was scuffed and painted and sat in shop for 3-4 months, then one morning pulled outside to wash up for owner to come and get. By 11:00 the car was blistering.

Remember, lacquers deteriorate from the time they are new, just like the plastic in you car.
The cause of this is the lacquer say is xamount of years old and has say lost half of its solvency, when you apply fresh solvents over it, it will soak some solvents up and you may have one area that has soaked enough to be newer then the paint next to it and they will expand at a different rate and blister time.

 

[mike the painter]

Hey barry ,Mike (from augusta) here .also one thing you might have over looked is that a lot of times a car will be primed in the shop insted of the paint booth where the proper filters are located...I've seen this time and time again..oil and other contaminats come out the body shop lines.the one time this happend to me was on my first paint job with a homemade compressor that I had to oil through the air intake when the piston started slapping around...The job looked so good nobody believed I painted it myself (even the shop owners I was working for thought I was lying )it was centari without hardner it flowed out like glass my friends dad paid 500.00 bucks and couldnt be happier ..that is till he coverd it up for winter...come spring the whole car had those same little tiny bubbles from the atomized oil mixed in with the paint.but the cure is the same strip it !!! Any ideas on a good epoxy primer ?that SPI stuff I've been useing just seams to stick TO good to my OSPHO. LOL.. I'll be calling with my next experiment results. glad to have ya back...even if its just an exception,you've been missed.... :welcome:

 

[BarryK]

Water can do that but depending on the water and where it will normally react inside of six months.

I don't want to hear about any experiments with that cuss word you used.
Want to see what it will do? Go to the SPI User forum and look under " 2K primer cracking, you must have a bad batch"
its a 70 Chevell convertible that I went and looked at.

I think I posted it under general spi info. Sad deal the poor guy at this point has $20,000 into the car that needs to be re-stripped.

http://spi.forumup.org/viewtopic.php?t=2999&mforum=spi
Yep, exact same stuff!

 

[mike the painter]

its worth stripping....but if cash is short(like it is for me) you can always just re paint the top surfaces and run a stripe between the two paints and hope for the best,then redo the sides another time,mabee run a buffer over the sides to shine it up some.that'll get you on the road quicker too.since most of the bodywork and damage is always on the sides and that'll have/should be redone also.

 

[mike the painter]

Water can do that but depending on the water and where it will normally react inside of six months.

I don't want to hear about any experiments with that cuss word you used.
Want to see what it will do? Go to the SPI User forum and look under " 2K primer cracking, you must have a bad batch"
its a 70 Chevell convertible that I went and looked at.

I think I posted it under general spi info. Sad deal the poor guy at this point has $20,000 into the car that needs to be re-stripped.

http://spi.forumup.org/viewtopic.php?t=2999&mforum=spi
Yep, exact same stuff!

also as a compressor wears out oil WILL slip through ,past the rings into the air supply.....another horror story from someone not following directions? or improperly using OSPHO? I've heard them all..still millions of us swear by it... yep same exact stuff just a differnt user...tell that guy to sand it first before priming just like any other coating (like primer and paint) "since it is a primer" 180 works well for me.check his air quality never assume its fine, looking at the outside take it apart .most likely the decisent balls are old and look like orange glass and all stuck together.

 

[cyclopsblown34]

Brain Deadbodyman, what is this OSPHO you speak of? Some of us Go Ruinityourselfers are not privy to this terminology.

 

[mike the painter]

Brain Deadbodyman, what is this OSPHO you speak of? Some of us Go Ruinityourselfers are not privy to this terminology.

Just google "ospho" then PM me...(off topic),I shouldn't have brought it up.but those of us that use it ,swear by it !!! those that DONT have nothing good to say about it. reading directions is important...following them is a MUST !!!