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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I plan on eventually buying a crate engine for a street rod project I have planned for the future. A company I've ran across that makes a very desirable looking 396 small block stroker is White Performance and Machine.
Is White Performance a good manufacturer to buy from? If not, what other suggestions do you guys have?
 

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Fred White has been in business many years, has a solid reputation in his area(Tennessee).

I wouldn't be afraid of an engine from him.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
American speed looks a little pricier, but their QC and testing claims appear to make their engines worth the extra money. I notice the AS Brutus 535 396 ci. and WP&M 396 engines both make use of the same Eagle 4340 crankshaft. The AS has a 195cc head as opposed to the WP&M's 200cc, but American Speed's head choice is AFR. Both engines also use Eagle con-rods. Don't know enough about all of those parts to be able to say if any of them are good to go or not. If anybody's interested, I will link both engines below.

SBC Deluxe Turn Key 396 Stroker Engine w/700R4 Transmission - 558 HP | eBay
chevy engines crate engines racing engines gm crate engines 350 chevy engine high performance chevy engines chevy crate engine chevrolet engines big block engines chevrolet crate engine chevy muscle chevy engine chevy crate engines chevrolet crate mo
 

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are you looking for better or more powerful?
AFR heads are about the best heads as delivered you can buy. Profiler heads are excellent.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
More power is always nice, but I'd rather have better quality parts that are going to last a long time.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
look at Scott shafiroff 427
It's funny that you suggested this manufacturer. I was on his website a short time before you recommended him. He's got a 402 package that I like the look of. The 427 on there for 700 dollars more looks like an attractive option, too.
 

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I only recommend a few crate engine suppliers. Shafiroff delivers what he says. My friend John Graham in Calgary bought a sportsman 540 for his progas car and it was the last engine he bought before retiring. It worked perfectly and never blew up. John freshed the engine once in 10 years.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I only recommend a few crate engine suppliers. Shafiroff delivers what he says. My friend John Graham in Calgary bought a sportsman 540 for his progas car and it was the last engine he bought before retiring. It worked perfectly and never blew up. John freshed the engine once in 10 years.
That's awesome. Sounds like it was a great investment. I'll definitely keep Shafiroff in mind.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
engine kits are often a lot cheaper than a running engine. Since there is no warranty but you get to assemble it your self and make sure all the parts are right.

I like to build it my self but the engines from white are very nicely priced but i think you can buy everything to build that motor for less than the actual motor cost. Just still comes with all machine work and still going to be bolt together and get the hp numbers. When you buy it from them.
Long as I can find somebody that can time the cam and balance the crank if need be. The bolting parts together I can do myself, but don't have the tools needed to do them, although I may buy a cam timing wheel later on.
 

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I've got a cousin with a Shafiroff 588" BBC in his Dirt/Mud Drag Jeep, 980 HP and it's been perfect for 6 or 7 years now.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Options Narrowed Down

Of everything I've looked at so far from various different websites, I'm looking at either the WP&M 396 I linked earlier or the Shafiroff 402 small block I'll link below. Some looking around on ebay reviews tells me that Fred White's engines are good for the money, but I'm getting the feel from this thread that the Shafiroff is going to serve me better in the long run. I've looked at a GM ZZ454 also, but for the money and the displacement, 469 horse just isn't all that attractive to me. I've seen 454s that'll make more horsepower for around 5 grand on Phoenix Engines. I'll link those below also.

402 Small Block Chevy Pump Gas Engine
Chevy 454 - 375 to 502HP Crate Engine (454 crates)
 

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My opinion, and looks like you've reached a similar conclusion...is that GM Performance crate engines are vastly over-rated and low on power for the cost compared to aftermarket engine builders.

About the only GM crates worth buying are the replacement L31 Vortec crate motor. Stuff like the ZZ4 crate is 100HP short compared to the same size and cost aftermarket performance engine.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
My opinion, and looks like you've reached a similar conclusion...is that GM Performance crate engines are vastly over-rated and low on power for the cost compared to aftermarket engine builders.

About the only GM crates worth buying are the replacement L31 Vortec crate motor. Stuff like the ZZ4 crate is 100HP short compared to the same size and cost aftermarket performance engine.
Yeah, the GM ones all look pretty underpowered. The aforementioned ZZ454, for example, is over 7,000 dollars on jegs, and it's not a turnkey. I could get a 454 from Phoenix that makes a little more power for over a grand cheaper that is a turnkey. Or, I could buy the 396 stroker that's turnkey AND comes with a 700r4 for the same price as the ZZ. So, I firmly agree with your opinion on GM Performance crate engines.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Could also get a phoenix 454 crate and a transmission for even less money than the 396 stroker drivetrain, now that I think about it...
 

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Shafiroff engines have options,,, If you want another 50 hp(example) they step up the cam profile and or heads etc.
The street engines are conservative with room to grow.

How much power do you need?
Will your car be able to use the bigger power?
If you choose a rat, the 540 in the 600-700 hp range is the best deal
Not many cars are set up to go 9s,,,,,
 

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Instead of looking at e-bay ads, call the builder directly. They may have something they can package for similar money; that is fine-tuned for your needs. eBay stuff is mass-market appeal; quick turnover because you have listing fees and paypal fees etc.
Call em both, get a feel for who they are and what they would change to meet your needs directly. Write them both down, or ask for a quote. Compare/contrast and above all...be realistic with yourself.

Ive got several Shafiroff customers, and a couple Phoenix and FRED White's too. Nothing bad to say about any of them. Im sure accidents happen; all the more reason to have a sit-down with your prospective vendor. Being on a name basis definitely helps when you have some teething issues.

People buy the GM crate based on the theory of QC and warranty service...I have a LOT of customers with them; but the very public fiasco's with the 383 crates going through oil like my furnace, and the drawn-out R&R process, has soured a LOT of prospective buyers from a performance GM crate.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Shafiroff engines have options,,, If you want another 50 hp(example) they step up the cam profile and or heads etc.
The street engines are conservative with room to grow.

How much power do you need?
Will your car be able to use the bigger power?
If you choose a rat, the 540 in the 600-700 hp range is the best deal
Not many cars are set up to go 9s,,,,,
Somewhere along the lines of 500 horsepower, up to around 550. I don't need anymore than that, and anything in that range is satisfactory.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Instead of looking at e-bay ads, call the builder directly. They may have something they can package for similar money; that is fine-tuned for your needs. eBay stuff is mass-market appeal; quick turnover because you have listing fees and paypal fees etc.
Call em both, get a feel for who they are and what they would change to meet your needs directly. Write them both down, or ask for a quote. Compare/contrast and above all...be realistic with yourself.

Ive got several Shafiroff customers, and a couple Phoenix and FRED White's too. Nothing bad to say about any of them. Im sure accidents happen; all the more reason to have a sit-down with your prospective vendor. Being on a name basis definitely helps when you have some teething issues.

People buy the GM crate based on the theory of QC and warranty service...I have a LOT of customers with them; but the very public fiasco's with the 383 crates going through oil like my furnace, and the drawn-out R&R process, has soured a LOT of prospective buyers from a performance GM crate.
I'll take note of that. Knowing exactly who I'm dealing with would also make me feel a lot more comfortable than buying from somebody that I have zero clue who they are. Especially when we're talking about this kind of money.
 
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