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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I just painted everything from the hood back on my car. I used Nason Acrylic Enamel, Nason medium reducer and Transtar classic catalyst. The paint came out severely orange peeled almost powder coat looking. It didn’t flow well at all from the start. I tried to reduce the fan, get closer, turn up the air…. Nothing seemed to make it flow. I’m thinking the different brand reducer, even though it was for acrylic enamel is the culprit. Does this sound about right or could something else be going on? The good news is the body work looks good. It just sucks that I have rework the paint now. :eek:
 

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Brian Martin,Freelance adviser
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CADI70 said:
I just painted everything from the hood back on my car. I used Nason Acrylic Enamel, Nason medium reducer and Transtar classic catalyst. The paint came out severely orange peeled almost powder coat looking. It didn’t flow well at all from the start. I tried to reduce the fan, get closer, turn up the air…. Nothing seemed to make it flow. I’m thinking the different brand reducer, even though it was for acrylic enamel is the culprit. Does this sound about right or could something else be going on? The good news is the body work looks good. It just sucks that I have rework the paint now. :eek:
NEVER use a different brand hardener. FOLLOW THE TECH SHEETS for the least amount of troubles.

One of the most over used terms in painting is "letting it flow out". You want to spray it on as you want to see it, yes there is some "flow out" to some degree but you have an orange looking car because gun set up and spray technique.

Because you used a different brand hardener, who knows? It's anyones guess that the hardener caused it making it too thick or something because the product was made for something else. I don't know a think about Transtar but did a quick look for you and there are two "Classic" hardeners, one is part number 7038 for synthetic enamel while the other is 8078 and is for acrylic enamel like you were spraying. Did you use the wrong one?

See, when you go out of the tech sheets for the products you are using, you have to start thinking a lot more, learning a lot more, and trusting your knowledge a lot more. Follow the tech sheets and you don't have to do a thing but spray the stuff.

I have no idea if your mixing ratio was right or wrong, now with a different hardener, who knows. :confused:

Get a test panel, an old fender (you can pick one up at the local body shop they are thrilled to give them to you so they don't have to throw them away) and do some testing.

Here is a basic idea of setting the gun up and atomization. http://www.autobodystore.com/ms6.shtml

Brian
 

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boatbob2
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Reducer ,not Catalyst...........

You sprayed your paint without enough reducer TOO DRY,,use a ZAHN cup,to get proper mix of paint and reducer.(paint supply place) (follow manufacturers recommendations) NEVER mix products from different manufacturers. :nono:
 

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Brian Martin,Freelance adviser
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boatbob2 said:
You sprayed your paint without enough reducer TOO DRY,,use a ZAHN cup,to get proper mix of paint and reducer.(paint supply place) (follow manufacturers recommendations) NEVER mix products from different manufacturers. :nono:
Bob, he USED a different brand catalyst! He is talking about a different reducer but used Nason paint with transtar catalyst. That is what thru me off, I didn't catch that now he is talking going to a different reducer TOO. :rolleyes:

If it's reduced by the manufacturers recommendation you don't need a ZAHN cup. But damn they are nice when you want to really get a hold of what you are doing. I used it in the lacquer days on every job. But these days, 4-2-1 and your done. :) (or what ever the mixing ratio on the tech sheet is).

Brian
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Thanks for the link MARTINSR. Good info. I just came back from the paint store. The catalyst is correct according to them. Different brand but works and is cheaper. I was worried about its age as well. I’ve had it for over a year. Still they seemed unconcerned with it since it’s still very much in liquid form. Also I brought my mixing cup and demonstrated how I mix. They said I was doing it correct. They seem to point me to gun setup. They basically told me to make sure to do a good practice run prior to mixing up too much paint. Also add reducer if necessary. Truth be told, I did this but couldn’t get the gun to give me a good spray. It kept coming out like oversized pixels on a TV screen, big droplets that didn’t run together well. I’ve had a conventional gravity feed for years. It’s an el-cheapo Lowes gun but it’s given me some good paint jobs in the past. Would it be worth investing in an HVLP gun? If I try again with my current gun my plan is to clean the [email protected]^* out of the gun and be liberal with the reducer. Another thing, I was using Medium reducer that’s good to 85deg. It shouldn’t have been a problem but I bought the slower kind to hedge my bets. I’ll have to look into getting a ZAHN cup. I never check viscosity but maybe it’s time to.
 

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boatbob2
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Hi Brian.......

Hi,im not quite sure WHAT he was talking about,Reducer? catylst?or whatever,BUT,i ALSO dont listen to those paint store people,MOST ,have NO IDEA what theyre talking about.i dont mix products,i dont care about the cost,how much is a screwed up paint job worth??? I agree on the 4-2-1 mix,BUT,MAYBE his mix was off,thats why i recommended the zahn cup,years ago,i also used a zahn cup,for mixing lacquer,now,i mostly mix a little reducer,(after the correct amount of catylst)and watch the drops off of the stir stix,if,the drop falls with a tail,more reducer,but,i add the reducer slowly as soon as i get a drop with no tail,im good to go,I dont paint much anymore,but,ive painted many cars and airplanes in the past..AND,i honestly cant remember the last time i messed up a paint job... :mwink: :mwink:
 

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Brian Martin,Freelance adviser
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boatbob2
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Zahn Cup,,,

Hi,yes,that is a ZAHN cup,basically the way I use it,mix your paint as recommended,by the tech sheet,no reducer.fill cup,time how long it takes the paint to empty the cup. (in seconds) write that time down,add a little reducer,time it,keep adding reducer (a LITTLE) at a time,when the time to empty the ZAHN cup,is the same (or very close) to the tech sheet,your finished. I forgot,if youre going to use a pint,quart or gallon,you MUST mix that amount with CATYLST (hardner) and add the reducer to the whole amount,your going to use.,i have seen guys add the reducer to the amount of paint in the cup,that does NOTHING. ALSO,if you go to your paint supplier,they MAY give you a zahn cup, IF you buy a lot of paint from them,,that one on FLEA BAY is overpriced. use the white plastic one,easier to clean.
 
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