[Slipangle]

This is on my 1960 Plymouth Valiant. I bought new drums, which don't include the hubs, so I needed to remove the old hub from my old brake drum, and to do that I needed to press out the wheel studs. I have new studs, as a bonus when I get to the left side I'll be able to change to RH thread, but I'm finding that when the new studs are in the wheel, they aren't a press fit.

Dorman sells a .563 spline and a .570 spline, both are loose fits. They probably aren't going to spin but if I install it they'll probably back out the next time I need to take the wheel off.

Anyone have a magical source for new hubs? Or is this something weldable? I'm somewhat suspecting the hub is a grade of iron that's not going to cooperate with weld.

 

[chasracer]

Why would you remove the studs from the hubs? The hubs and drums are separate components. Then you say that the Dorman replacements are a loose fit? Then they are not the right replacements.

 

[ericnova72]

You can search for studs by length, thread size, and knurl/spline size.

If needed, you can go to an even bigger spline, say .620" since I know that is a common size....drill your hubs to take a bigger spline size.

Welding up and redrilling just to keep the stock size is not a smart plan.

Another option if you want to attempt it is there are types of Loctite formulated to lock up semi-slip fits....the green is what I've used on other applications, Stud and Bearing Mount was the name of it, #290 if I remember correctly but there are a lot more choices today so you'd have to do your homework and some searching.

 

[Slipangle]

Why would you remove the studs from the hubs? The hubs and drums are separate components. Then you say that the Dorman replacements are a loose fit? Then they are not the right replacements.

The drum wouldn't come off the hub without pressing oit the studs. The drum was bending without seperating.

 

[Slipangle]

You can search for studs by length, thread size, and knurl/spline size.

If needed, you can go to an even bigger spline, say .620" since I know that is a common size....drill your hubs to take a bigger spline size.

Welding up and redrilling just to keep the stock size is not a smart plan.

Another option if you want to attempt it is there are types of Loctite formulated to lock up semi-slip fits....the green is what I've used on other applications, Stud and Bearing Mount was the name of it, #290 if I remember correctly but there are a lot more choices today so you'd have to do your homework and some searching.

When i was suggesting weld what i was thinking was tack welds of the head of the studs to secure them in place.

 

[joe_padavano]

Many cars from the 1960s that pressed the studs through the hub and into the drum actually peened the studs in place. GM had a set of Kent Moore tools that allowed you to cut the peened area before pressing the stud out to prevent oversizing the hole, and another tool to peen the new stud to hold it in place. Naturally, I didn't do that on my car and I oversized the holes. I was able to find studs with a large enough knurl to fit securely. On other vehicles, I've also used a small tack weld on the backside of the hub to ensure the stud doesn't spin. Be sure to grind off any zinc plating on the new stud where you plan to tack it, and go in hot and fast with a small tack to minimize the heat affected zone in the stud.

 

[chasracer]

The drum wouldn't come off the hub without pressing oit the studs. The drum was bending without seperating.

Ahh, so you didn't do the job right and now you have a mess on your hands. I get it now. Sorry for your troubles but since you were putting new drums on, did you really care if the old ones got bent?
A couple of things for the future, Kroil Oil soaked around the hub flange for a few hours would have loosened a lot of the rust. Then an application of heat - you could have used a butane type torch if you don't have a hot wrench on hand or even putting them in the oven for an hour at about 400 degrees. A last ditch would have been to grind the top of the drum away in the area just outside of the hub diameter. With the outer portion of the drum gone, you probably could have gotten a stiff blade between the remaining part of the brake drum and the hub and hammered them apart.

At this point if you can't find some oversized studs to fit, you can clean things up and tack the studs in a couple of places. Just understand that if they get hit with an air gun, they'll probably break loose eventually and you'll need to tack them again. Make sure you have the seal out when you do this as it will be ruined from the welding.

 

[brading]

I am with Eric on this one. Go for a larger knurl/spline even if you have to drill to suit. Last thing you want is to have a stud spining when you are changing a flat on the side of the road.

 

[Slipangle]

Many cars from the 1960s that pressed the studs through the hub and into the drum actually peened the studs in place. GM had a set of Kent Moore tools that allowed you to cut the peened area before pressing the stud out to prevent oversizing the hole, and another tool to peen the new stud to hold it in place. Naturally, I didn't do that on my car and I oversized the holes. I was able to find studs with a large enough knurl to fit securely. On other vehicles, I've also used a small tack weld on the backside of the hub to ensure the stud doesn't spin. Be sure to grind off any zinc plating on the new stud where you plan to tack it, and go in hot and fast with a small tack to minimize the heat affected zone in the stud.

This is absolutely the case with this car. The stud splines on the thread side look like they had been swaged wider, and I can see where pressing those studs out may have been like a broaching operation to open up the holes.

Just to give some general background, the last time I replaced a set of brake drum brakes was in the '90's. Since beginning married life in 2001 I've done a lot less car work, and where I''ve done brake work it was a disc brake conversion on a '56 Mercury or disc brakes on daily drivers, my first work being '55 Ford brakes in the late '80's.

And whatever I'm saying above, I'm just providing more detail and not being argumentative. I'm open to any ideas and appreciative of discussion here.

Truth be told I don't think I ever had to replace a front brake drum on any of my '55 Fords unless I had a brake drum with the hub installed.

Also on the table if things went badly enough was a disc brake conversion. Truth be told I probably didn't need to replace the drums, the mileage on this car isn't that high and I don't think the thickness has gone down much, and to be certain there aren't even wear grooves. Same could be said for the shoes. But one of the rear drums had a large piece fall off at the edge, so I figured it's best to just put a new set of drums. And the brake job is something my dad started before he passed and he had what seemed like all the necessary materials, so I figured he was probably just doing the whole job because there was probably a fluid leak somewhere before he started the project.

 

[Slipangle]

I am with Eric on this one. Go for a larger knurl/spline even if you have to drill to suit. Last thing you want is to have a stud spining when you are changing a flat on the side of the road.

So if I was to go about this, I'd most likely put the hub on a drill press my dad had. Ideally I'd probably want to put it on a Bridgeport, but I don't have one. I'd have to rely on the drill to do a reasonable job of keeping the new hole centered on the old one, and where I mention above that the spline broached the hole open - some of the studs broke off some of the swaged spline so I may be introducing some small amount of unevenness.

 

[joe_padavano]

Dorman P/N 610-114 is a 7/16-20 wheel stud with a 0.582" knurl. I think these are the ones I used on my 62 Olds. FYI, that Olds also had LH threads on the driver side. Even the spindle nut on that side is LH thread.

Dorman Products - 610-114

7/16-20 Serrated Wheel Stud - .582 In. Knurl, 1-21/32 In. Length

www.dormanproducts.com

 

[ericnova72]

Drill press will work just fine, you are only taking a very small cut of .030-.050" according to whatever you choose for stud size, a sharp drill will have no problem following the hole even with some chipped out sections.....a milling machine isn't a neccessity.

'60 Valiant would be 1/2"-20 thread stud?

 

[joe_padavano]

Drill press will work just fine, you are only taking a very small cut of .030-.050" according to whatever you choose for stud size, a sharp drill will have no problem following the hole even with some chipped out sections.....a milling machine isn't a neccessity.

'60 Valiant would be 1/2"-20 thread stud?

^^^THIS. I'm no Chrysler expert, I assumed 7/16" but I really have no idea. Dorman has a number of 1/2-20 studs with knurl diameters from 0.585" up to 0.684". I suspect that the 0.585" knurl will press right in without drilling.

 

[Slipangle]

It is a 7/16-20 thread, and I was looking at Dorman 610-114 as it happens when I went to the Dorman site and searched their catalogue.

 

[ericnova72]

Felt I should add....if you drill them oversize, turn the drill slow, less than 100 rpm would be ideal.

 

[joe_padavano]

It is a 7/16-20 thread, and I was looking at Dorman 610-114 as it happens when I went to the Dorman site and searched their catalogue.

I would verify what size the holes have been opened up to already before drilling anything. As I said, when I did this, I didn't need to drill the hubs. These 0.582 knurls just pressed right in. They've been there for 11 years now.

 

[Slipangle]

I would verify what size the holes have been opened up to already before drilling anything. As I said, when I did this, I didn't need to drill the hubs. These 0.582 knurls just pressed right in. They've been there for 11 years now.

I tried it and sure enough, the .582 knurls pressed right in and the drum slides right on to the hub. Heck of a lot better than finding a machine shop supply store, not going to find a 37/64 drill off the shelf at any chain hardware, auto parts or big box stores.

 

[joe_padavano]

I tried it and sure enough, the .582 knurls pressed right in and the drum slides right on to the hub. Heck of a lot better than finding a machine shop supply store, not going to find a 37/64 drill off the shelf at any chain hardware, auto parts or big box stores.

Good news. FYI, when you do need an off-beat piece like that drill bit, McMaster Carr is the place.

 

[brading]

Glad to hear you got it sorted without to much hassle.