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Just because the bottle says "FULL SYNTHETIC" that doesn't mean that the oil contained within is 100% synthetic, and I'm NOT talking about Synthetics vs. Synthetic blends.
The major oil sellers are ripping off people with the term "Full Synthetic". Full Synthetic does NOT mean 100% synthetic, again, I'm not talking about Synthetic Blends.

If the engine oil is not made from Group 4(Poly-alpha-olefin) or Group 5 oil base, it's NOT a 100% synthetic oil.
Group 3 oils are all cracked from hydrocarbons(dinosaur oil or natural gas), therefore are NOT 100% synthetic. There is a lot of propaganda out there stating that high quality synthetic oil is cracked from Natural gas, this is simply not true. This is merely repeated over and over in attempt to brainwash the public into believing the "Full Synthetic" semantics.
A big indicator between Full synthetics that are cracked from dinosaur oil and/or Natural Gas, but are really a quality conventional motor oil and 100% true Synthetic engine oil is the cost.
True 100% synthetic oils will double the price of an oil change, not just add $5-$10 to the cost.
When buying engine oil, I would look and all the Full Synthetics were only $10 more per gallon than the conventional oils. I think to myself, Wow, what a great deal, I'm gonna buy that Synthetic oil, its only $10 more. I consider myself an intelligent person, so I know I'm not the only one who has been duped.




Explained here.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synthetic_oil#Full

Here is a straightforward article on the difference in the 5 types of lubrication, free of spin by the oil makers.
Understanding the Differences in Base Oil Groups

Wiki base oils
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Base_oil

IMO Wikipedia is fairly accurate as its seen by millions and point plus proof is usually required.

peace
Hog
 

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Just because the bottle says "FULL SYNTHETIC" that doesn't mean that the oil contained within is 100% synthetic, and I'm NOT talking about Synthetics vs. Synthetic blends.
The major oil sellers are ripping off people with the term "Full Synthetic". Full Synthetic does NOT mean 100% synthetic, again, I'm not talking about Synthetic Blends.

If the engine oil is not made from Group 4(Poly-alpha-olefin) or Group 5 oil base, it's NOT a 100% synthetic oil.
Group 3 oils are all cracked from hydrocarbons(dinosaur oil or natural gas), therefore are NOT 100% synthetic. There is a lot of propaganda out there stating that high quality synthetic oil is cracked from Natural gas, this is simply not true. This is merely repeated over and over in attempt to brainwash the public into believing the "Full Synthetic" semantics.
A big indicator between Full synthetics that are cracked from dinosaur oil and/or Natural Gas, but are really a quality conventional motor oil and 100% true Synthetic engine oil is the cost.
True 100% synthetic oils will double the price of an oil change, not just add $5-$10 to the cost.
When buying engine oil, I would look and all the Full Synthetics were only $10 more per gallon than the conventional oils. I think to myself, Wow, what a great deal, I'm gonna buy that Synthetic oil, its only $10 more. I consider myself an intelligent person, so I know I'm not the only one who has been duped.




Explained here.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synthetic_oil#Full

Here is a straightforward article on the difference in the 5 types of lubrication, free of spin by the oil makers.
Understanding the Differences in Base Oil Groups

Wiki base oils
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Base_oil

IMO Wikipedia is fairly accurate as its seen by millions and point plus proof is usually required.

peace
Hog
So true the buyer must always beware. Same thing with Organic stuff at the grocery or drug store, it the "Organic" fraction only needs to meet a moderate threshold before they can call it that, it doesn't have to come anywhere close to 100%.

Bogie
 

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Discussion Starter #23
So there is a relationship to additive parts per million (ppm) and either oil change interval or replenishment of the additive. If we assume that at 1600 ppm in the good old days was good for 4000 miles then oil with less additive at 800 ppm should be changed at half that at 2000 miles. This assumes a linear function which may not be that simple as there are some reports that say below 800 ppm the effect of the additive is not there. So like a lithium battery's charge there may be a point where the utilization curve suddenly drops to zero as the concentration falls below a threshold.

Bogie
ok so you tell me period of changing oil depend on zdp additive contain
but for example SN grade oil have lower zdp lower than 800ppm
if i buy this oil with high cost but interval is lower than 2k miles is true ?
if yes when i buy sg oil i will have higher zdp additive and result is higher miles for interval change but lower cost

if i want to choose one of them definitely i choose sg grade not sn !!

and just zdp additive specific interval oil change or cylinder number is important ?
tnx
 

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Man, that GM bulletin is enlightening!

Have to say I've been running regular old 10W-30 "starburst" oil in a Chevy 350 I built in 2004 with no issues at all. The cam is an old school grind with moderate ramps, springs are Edelbrock stock replacements with around 90# on the seat, and I did use CompCams #159 break-in lube and broke-in the engine at 1800-2200 RPM for 20 minutes.

What can you tell us about the cam & valve springs? And is this a brand new engine, or has it been broken in?
 

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I've edited the title of this thread and stickied it for others to look at before posting over and over again regarding the ZDDP issue.

You can argue who is right and who is wrong regarding levels of additives in the oils you purchase but you cannot argue with mfg testing that supports proper protection is achieved with any modern S rated oil available everywhere.

Please review the GM bulletin posted in this thread, it should answer any questions you have regarding ZDDP in your oil. Not happy with that, there are plenty of aftermarket additives you can add to make yourself happy....blend away.

Many additives like STP have additional high pressure components that are actually superior to ZDDP if you have a high lift cam and high pressure springs controlling your valve train. Just be aware flat tappet cams don't last forever and if your running a lot of pressure and high rpm no additive is going to change the law of physics, it was common knowledge back in the day a cam would go flat in less than 10 000 miles if you were on the bleeding edge of what was possible with a flat tappet cam no matter what oil you were using.

Today you can purchase micro hole lifters to help combat this issue, all the bad soft core cams are likely out of the system when mfg went to china and they went through their learning curve regarding heat treatment and lobe finishes.

As always the bet protection you can buy is regular oil changes to get micro contaminants out of the oil which act as lapping compound, most filters don't get anything below 10 microns and some don't get anything finer than 50 microns...that means extra fine lapping paste in your engine constantly being recirculated!

Don't believe everything you read, there are literally millions of cars out there running just fine because the owner has no idea his car has a flat tappet cam in it not to mention the millions of OHC engines with bucket over shim actuation that works the same as a flat tappet.

Don't get sucked in by the hype, do your research and use common sense.
 
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Discussion Starter #26
What can you tell us about the cam & valve springs? And is this a brand new engine, or has it been broken in?
tnx
my cam is 3702 eddy with std springs
my engine is old not new
no i want to buy 3702 then after break in cam use for daily driving
now I'm investigating for recommended oil to protect new cam will i buy that not to make a mistake for my engine .

i think with this cam and stock std springs if i use SG-SJ oil or SN with STP additive my engine have a safe conditions true ?

I've edited the title of this thread and stickied it for others to look at before posting over and over again regarding the ZDDP issue.

Please review the GM bulletin posted in this thread

Many additives like STP have additional high pressure components that are actually superior to ZDDP if you have a high lift cam and high pressure springs controlling your valve train. Just be aware flat tappet cams don't last forever and if your running a lot of pressure and high rpm no additive is going to change the law of physics, it was common knowledge back in the day a cam would go flat in less than 10 000 miles if you were on the bleeding edge of what was possible with a flat tappet cam no matter what oil you were using.

Today you can purchase micro hole lifters to help combat this issue, all the bad soft core cams are likely out of the system when mfg went to china and they went through their learning curve regarding heat treatment and lobe finishes.

As always the bet protection you can buy is regular oil changes to get micro contaminants out of the oil which act as lapping compound, most filters don't get anything below 10 microns and some don't get anything finer than 50 microns...that means extra fine lapping paste in your engine constantly being recirculated!

Don't believe everything you read, there are literally millions of cars out there running just fine because the owner has no idea his car has a flat tappet cam in it not to mention the millions of OHC engines with bucket over shim actuation that works the same as a flat tappet.

Don't get sucked in by the hype, do your research and use common sense.

tnx for rename subject :thumbup:

ok i'll read gm bulletin
yeah i know but how much STP must add to primary oil for every change ?
Chevy sbc or L6 need 4.5 Litters oil for 4.5 how much stp need ?

omg your means if i use best oil again not important
if i run that engine with high RPMs and use high pressure springs and cam finally my cam after 10k miles damaged and i must change with a new one ?
but with low lift and std spring no is this true ?
after researching i decide to use low lift cam like 3702 or 2102 eddy and std springs for long cam life not 10k miles !

is my theory true ?

whats micro hole lifters ?

yeah but those are use shower oil lubricant system for cam for example XU7 engine of Peugeot cars ...

tnq vry much
 

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If you're going to run the engine hard, get a high performance oil. Mobil1 is good for your stock engine, but does not contain alot of the additives that are beneficial in a high performance engine. Look at the Castrol or Valvoline racing oils.

WRONG!


Wish the hell people would quit trying to recommend racing oils for street use. Unless your going to drop the oil and filter every 30 days to get it out of there you're causing more damage to your engine than good. Racing oils are meant to be warm then hot and provide protection for long periods of high RPM usage. They do not contain the detergents that a street engine needs, nor the cold start lubrication that a street engine needs. Run racing oil for 3000 miles of street use, pull the pan and take a look at the crap you have there. They also are very damaging to the emission systems of today's modern cars. Nothing like having to replace expensive catalytic units because you ran the wrong oil in your engine.
 

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Discussion Starter #28
thanks men

i decide to use sg oil grade or sj for flat tappet cam with maximum 0.425 valve lift
but for higher lift i will be use roller cam and ...


tnx for reply
 

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Regarding the Starburst oil "Sequence IIIG" test that evaluates cam and lifter wear with using a V6 engine with a flat-tappet system, similar to those used in the 1980s: I wonder what the valve spring seat pressure was. 70-80 pounds?

Sure would interesting to see a test using a solid lifter 350 from an early 70s Z28. That would be a heck of a lot more relevant to hot rodders.
 

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I came across this while surfing for an answer for you concerning different grades of oil and the additive content......

Grade Zinc, Phos
SM MAX 800
SL/SJ 1000-1400
SH 1000-1400
SG 1000-1400
SF 1000-1400
SE 1000-1200
SD 1000-1200
SC 1000-1200
SB 1000
SA 0
 

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Discussion Starter #32
I came across this while surfing for an answer for you concerning different grades of oil and the additive content......

Grade Zinc, Phos
SM MAX 800
SL/SJ 1000-1400
SH 1000-1400
SG 1000-1400
SF 1000-1400
SE 1000-1200
SD 1000-1200
SC 1000-1200
SB 1000
SA 0
thank you so much

these are good info about oil grades that i need to know !
tnx
 

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If you can get Shell Rotella 15w-40 engine oil. That should have approx 1200 PPM of zinc and mang. If you can get Lucas zddp additive you only need a few ounces of it to add to the rotella. I was informed by Lucas that Flat tappet camshafts need roughly 1500 ppm of zddp additive to prevent premature wear. Hope this helps.
 
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