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Discussion Starter #1
Hello all it's been awhile since I've posted.I have just finished putting a 454 big block in my 77 Buick Skylark.It was not as hard as everyone said it would be.I didn't even have to change the throttle cable.Everything bolted right up.It lined up better than the 350 I took out.And as far as the small block versus big block argument that ended the first time I put the pedal to the floor!This thing is a monster!As far as I'm concerned I'll never build or waste my money building a small block again!I built this motor with very little cash and it will absolutely run circles around the 350 I had in the car.And forget what everyone says about the weight of a big block.They make more than enough power to overcome it.BELIEVE!
 

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How about the specs on the motor. I have been wanting to go the big block route myself. Its more expensive to do the big block but its probably worth it. I wonder if what your feeling is the increase of the low end torque. The big block has a lot more rotating mass which will give more torque.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
049 heads milled 40 thousandths
summit 540/540 inch lift 228/238 duration
hedman hedders
flat top pistons 8.3 to1 compression ration
dual plane aluminum intake with 800 cfm quadrajet
th350 with 3:23 rear gears
I'm am very pleased with this setup although it doesn't have high compression I'm guessing it still makes around 400 horse.I know that it moves that car alot easier than the small block and it doesn't have to be reved very much to feel it shoving you in the seat.Tire smoke thru first and second if I don't baby it out of the hole!
 

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Car? Truck? Who Cares
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454 HO rollercam crate
Tremec TKO :D :D :D

Got a 454 in my 79 Chev 1/2 ton too :D
And another in the garage

Think I will use a SBC in the 66 elky tho-----gas mileage

More Cubes :D :D :D

Bryan
 

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Like the old saying goes "there is no replacement for displacement"
ive been hungry for a big block 3rd gen camaro lately (budget build), my small block truck is quick, but their is no such thing as to much power :thumbup:
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Yeah I would have to say that if your going to be fast on the street nowadays you need something special.Especially with all th new cars getting lighter and more powerful engines.Not to mention all the turbocharged cars out there. And don't get me wrong a love small blocks.A 350 is a great little motor.But this big block is a very mild build up and it has power everywhere.It would take quite a strong small block to to keep up with this thing.And I love it when the rear slides when it thumps into second.BELIEVE!!!!
 

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454me said:
How about the specs on the motor. I have been wanting to go the big block route myself. Its more expensive to do the big block but its probably worth it. I wonder if what your feeling is the increase of the low end torque. The big block has a lot more rotating mass which will give more torque.
How can rotating mass "give" you more torque? If anything increased rotating mass would retain the inertia from everything spinning. That would help maintain the momentum of say when you dump the clutch off the line helping to maintain momentum of the car going. What gives you more torque is displacement. The pistons are bigger in diameter giving the combusted mixture more surface area to expand against. The crankshaft stroke is longer, giving more leverage to overcome resistance of the mass your trying to move.
One thing rotating mass could do is affect how quickly the engine can overcome the resistance to rpm change. The lighter it is the easier or quicker it can change speed, the heavier the more difficult and longer it will take to rev up for example. However, trying to measure that is not that easy but can be done. Uhhh, try finding a built V6 and compare it to this guys big block. Stab the throttle on them a few times and see which one revs quicker. Racing them on a road course would be a good comparison if everything else was equal (car weight, gearing, tire size, etc).
 

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'' Amen Brother'' i will never build a sb for any thing but mpg..
i too had a sb in my 70 chevelle. with a 2.5 one legger rear end. i tried so hard to spin the tires with out powerbraking. some times it would just bairly other times it woudnt. put i mild bbc .put a 3.26 posi with anti hop bars. just taping the gas would spin the tires.
it will spin 10 x 26 tires thru 1st and 2nd gear, never tried 3thrd . too scary.. you just cant beat a bbc chevy. i think they are cheaper too build too. biggest reason is you use the stock heads. 781
who cares about the wieght of a bb. muscle cars arnt built for corners. made too go in a staight line. going fast on curves just get you killed..
 

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I was debating on whether to go with a BIG block (500+ inches) or a real wicked :evil: small block. I went onto the net and watched a few videos last night and remembered that sound only big inches make. For me that sweet sound of a big motor idling around the drive-in or thru the Fair grounds, compared to even a wicked small block just cannot be beat. Now I have to admit a wicked small block does sounds good, but next to a throaty big block, I like the sound of the big motor. Plus a mild cam in a big block is a lot less temper mental that a wicked small block.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Killer, Yes it did effect the handling of the car.It is more heavy up front and the car sits about 1 inch lower.But I don't use the car for circle track or closed course racing.The sound and the power let people know right away that this old car is not a poser.I will never put a small block on any weekend car again if I can afford to.My point is I guess is that it doesn't matter if it's a Chevy,Ford, or Dodge anything over 400 cubes is going to cost more but it will make more power with more stock parts!So in the long run you might save money.Especially if your looking to get 400+ horsepower.I only wish I went bigger!Yes it does use alot more fuel!
 

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Sounds to me like someone is driving their first car with decent power. Take it to the track and post what it runs. I think you are more excited about the torque than the HP. Don't get me wrong there is nothing wrong with a big block (they are great for towing, LOL). Seriously I have put more big blocks on the trailer with my street driven small block at the track than I care to remember. There is a place for everything. I bet if you would have built a healthy 383 you would be saying the same kind of things. I'm sure your 454 has more torque and hopefully more power than a stock 350, it would be a shame if it didn't. I am not trying to rain on your parade, I just think you are a bit over excited. Now if you go to the track and run 9's in street trim with a mild 454 I will respect that. Otherwise in a 77 Skylark you can get there with a small block, it's not a heavy car. I am not saying one is better than th other, just saying lets not poo poo the small blocks. I have been in many slow big block cars, so it's not all about cubic inches. If that was the case the larger engine would win everytime. We all know that doesn't happen, the guy with the most power doesn't always win either.

Glad your project came together not sure why anyone would tell it would be difficult, it's the same car as the later Novas.
 

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camaroman7d said:
Sounds to me like someone is driving their first car with decent power. Take it to the track and post what it runs. I think you are more excited about the torque than the HP. Don't get me wrong there is nothing wrong with a big block (they are great for towing, LOL). Seriously I have put more big blocks on the trailer with my street driven small block at the track than I care to remember. There is a place for everything. I bet if you would have built a healthy 383 you would be saying the same kind of things. I'm sure your 454 has more torque and hopefully more power than a stock 350, it would be a shame if it didn't. I am not trying to rain on your parade, I just think you are a bit over excited. Now if you go to the track and run 9's in street trim with a mild 454 I will respect that. Otherwise in a 77 Skylark you can get there with a small block, it's not a heavy car. I am not saying one is better than th other, just saying lets not poo poo the small blocks. I have been in many slow big block cars, so it's not all about cubic inches. If that was the case the larger engine would win everytime. We all know that doesn't happen, the guy with the most power doesn't always win either.

Glad your project came together not sure why anyone would tell it would be difficult, it's the same car as the later Novas.
Your missing his point, it was done on very little cash/power factor, its not temppermental at this power level, doesn't have to revved to the moon, moves very easy. Try all that with a shhhhhhmall bluck. And the best part of it is, he went out on a limb, used his head, and built a BIG BLOCK, YEAAAAAAAA! Not just another boring shhhhhhmall bluck also ran cookie cutter every one has one stinkn rotn poorly engineered etc etc etc shhhhhhmall bluck.
 

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QP,
What power level are we at here? I didn't see that stated. I also didn't see a budget. I never said there was anything wrong with a BBC but, to say SBC's are no good or can't compete is silly. I am sure he could have gone as fast or faster for the same cash in a SBC. Until you get serious (700HP range) then that's where the larger motors beging to really show a distinct advantage. "Out on a limb" to build a BBC? Get real, that is nothing new. These days they are more popular than SBC's.

What was the point?
 

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I gotta agree with the fact that power comes from the right combo of parts put together right. A big part of having a Hot Rod is how it sounds and dollar for dollar you can get more ear appeal with a big block. Having said that, remember while a cheap Small Block with headers and a wide cam will sound wicked at idle, it cannot back up its bark. So you just have to find the right balance of sound and power for the bucks you got. If money is no object then give me a call. I'm sure I have something around here you REALLY need. :)
 

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camaroman7d said:
QP,
to say SBC's are no good or can't compete is silly. I am sure he could have gone as fast or faster for the same cash in a SBC. "Out on a limb" to build a BBC? Get real, that is nothing new. These days they are more popular than SBC's.

What was the point?
Camaroman,
I am in a street rod club and we do many shows and the vast majority of rods/cars are small block chevy powered. True I am speaking my frustration and boredom through my post after putting up with every kissing cousins small block chevy powered street rod this summer.
I admit, in the end we just pour liquid fuel in the tank and spit out the exhaust pipe. I am sure if all I saw was Nailheads at every show I would be saying the same thing. But it does take a person with more imagination to go against the unwritten small block chevy rule when they put in a big block, heck, imagine if he put a pontiac engine in his car instead of a chevy. After all, by design alone the pontiac is superior to the chevy engine. I never saw a pre 80's chevy engine come from the factory with machined combustion chambers like some pontiacs have.
 

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I'm not going to argue with you that there are MANY SBC's out there. As far as Pontiacs being surperior, I would disagree. We'll just leave it at that. I too get tired of looking under every hood at a show and seeing a SBC. The thing is for a performance (non show) street car they are just fine in most cases. I'm guilty of the SBC thing too. I have one in my current project while it's not the "typical" project or engine, there are several reasons I went this route. I already built the engine and had it in a previous car, space limitations wouldn't allow a big block.

Once again I am in no way saying that the SBC is the king, just saying when built right they run well. They are popular for a reason. How many of those rods do you look under and see a 9" ford rear end? Why is that? They are easy to find, build, there are all kinds of aftermarket support (parts).
 

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[QU They are easy to find, build, there are all kinds of aftermarket support (parts).[/QUOTE]

I don't know how many times I have heard that point but I can go to any junk yard tomorrow morning and pick out a small block chevy, ford, and dodge.
Easy to build, how much more difficult is it to tighten a connecting rod nut on a Pontiac V8 compared to the ones on a Chevy V8? I don't know where this wives tale came from.
Aftermarket parts, there are more heads available for a Big Block Mopar that picking one out is confusing now.
I think this guy did a good job and I know what he means by power everywhere, I had a 455 Olds in a 1983 Delta 88 and a 350 Olds in a 87 Cutlass, both were built/warmed over for the street but the big block was soooooooo much more fun with tractor like torque.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Camaroman I'm the biggest sbc fan I know around here!I said that in my earlier post. I've built a 350 and I enjoyed it.It was a mild build up and ran pretty decent.But making power with the big block seemed much more easier to me.Plus I didn't have to spend money on aftermarket heads.I bought this motor at a junkyard for 100 dollars.I live in Mexico by the way and with the fuel prices nobody down here wants to buy big blocks or small blocks to be honest with you.Took it apart and got lucky that it had just been rebuilt.The previous owner had it in a truck and flipped it.I invested in a decent intake,headers,and cam and stabbed it in the skylark.I never said that a sbc can't make power and I'm sure that there are alot of sbc's that could whip me.But I have about 800 dollars in this motor and it really runs well.I guess I just had alot of luck getting a freshly rebuilt big block.I'm just saying that if you want to go fast and are on a tight budget a big block might be cheaper and different way to do the job.Sure some of the parts cost more but if your looking at building a motor that's going to use stock heads a big block will come out on top every time.
 
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