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Discussion Starter #1
I have a question about what primer to use its on a 70 model camaro,and I'm going to go with a met. blue paint.I was told to use urethane primer,and I saw some on e-bay,and it was Hi-buff would this work or which would be better? thanks for looking.
 

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Tell us more, Is this in baremetal and what kind of job do you expect. On old cars like that if still original or hasn't been painted for many years, It may be 1k primers and paint under there. To do an old car right, most will strip all paint and see what surprises a car that is almost 40 years old may have acquired during all those years. Then you have a true picture of what needs attention. Then most will get rid of any rust and epoxy prime, do body repairs, and use a urethane 2k if fill is needed on bodywork areas. The epoxy has better adhesion to bare metal and seals, where as urethane primer is porous, but typically has better build and sanding qualitys then epoxy. By your description it sounds like it is a high build urethane 2k primer in buff yellow color. You may have some problems getting coverage over it with base with a lot of colors. The blue may be a problem, and if a cheaper line of base, may really mean a lot of coats. I would think a medium grey color would be better. An epoxy used as a final sealer also then would be a good option if you get one that will be good for coverage of your base color. If using one of the bigger lines of base, they may be able to look at the mixing formula and tell you if it has coverage issues, and also what shade of primer for best coverage. It depends on what you are expecting out of it. You could sand the car, and use the urethane primer over the sanded paint and bare metal spots, but epoxy over baremetal first or stripping the whole car of any 1k products and starting fresh with epoxy after getting any rust that may be found would be a better plan. Even if you see no rust or no apparent shoddy work, doesn't necessarily mean its not there.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
kenseth17 said:
Tell us more, Is this in baremetal and what kind of job do you expect. On old cars like that if still original or hasn't been painted for many years, It may be 1k primers and paint under there. To do an old car right, most will strip all paint and see what surprises a car that is almost 40 years old may have acquired during all those years. Then you have a true picture of what needs attention. Then most will get rid of any rust and epoxy prime, do body repairs, and use a urethane 2k if fill is needed on bodywork areas. The epoxy has better adhesion to bare metal and seals, where as urethane primer is porous, but typically has better build and sanding qualitys then epoxy. By your description it sounds like it is a high build urethane 2k primer in buff yellow color. You may have some problems getting coverage over it with base with a lot of colors. The blue may be a problem, and if a cheaper line of base, may really mean a lot of coats. I would think a medium grey color would be better. An epoxy used as a final sealer also then would be a good option if you get one that will be good for coverage of your base color. If using one of the bigger lines of base, they may be able to look at the mixing formula and tell you if it has coverage issues, and also what shade of primer for best coverage. It depends on what you are expecting out of it. You could sand the car, and use the urethane primer over the sanded paint and bare metal spots, but epoxy over baremetal first or stripping the whole car of any 1k products and starting fresh with epoxy after getting any rust that may be found would be a better plan. Even if you see no rust or no apparent shoddy work, doesn't necessarily mean its not there.
I have took alot of it to the metal,and it has a primer I bought at napa on it. Its some kind thinner type primer. This is really alot more than I thought to it. I want to get it to a shop,and have them spray the final coat.If it was you what type,and brand would you use? I was told a urethane type primer would work,not sure, Do you rec. completely strip the car down of all the paint,and start over with some type of sealer? It really seems to be slick now with the red primer on it. I believe I have removed all the rust. The car is pretty solid. What would be the best thing for me to do. I want it to look nice,but it doesn't have to be perfect. This stuff is really something you can't jump into,but every panel is new including the doors,fenders,hood fiberglass, header panel valance panel . I would be happy to get it prepared right before it goes to have the final coat put on. If you could may-be tell me what type would be beginner friendly it would be greatly appreciated, Thanks for the excellent info,I have alot of learning to do about body work.
 

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Is this possibly a lacquer primer you put on? Was it thinned with lacquer thinner and no can of activator was included? If it is lacquer primer, I would personally take it off. Old days people put it over metal, but now there are much better products around no. Lacquer primer also shrinks alot (shrinks into your sanding scratches and then they show after it is painted) and problems such as edge mapping (and many others) of filler areas can show up later if you just paint over it.An epoxy primer instead would have much better adhesion and corrosion protection. Usually over the epoxy primer a urethane primer for its filling and ease of sanding are used, or a polyester primer if you really have a lot of fill needed, like if the body was pretty wavy. You need a gun that can spray these thicker materials though. If that is lacquer primer, I personally would strip it off. I know its not what you want to hear, but it sounds like you are sticking some money and a lot of sweat into it with new panels and stripping it down. It will be a far better choice for durability and lasting with the price of paint these days, you want your best chance for lasting a long time, so you don't really want to skip on the primers which are cheap in comparison. You may want to check with shine who is a member here. He has been using only SPI epoxy primer on the vette he's been doing (with a ton of bodywork). Its my understanding the spi has much better fill and sandability then most epoxy primers, and it could possibly save you from buying a urethane primer too. It also is available in a few different colors and you can also mix to get the shade you are looking for if needed. I haven't gotten the chance to try their epoxy yet. If its lacquer primer, if you don't take it off, you should at the very least defignately seal it with epoxy when the bodywork is all done and allow the primer some time to do its shrinking before final sanding. Both urethane and lacquer primer is porous, so if the paint surface would be compromised, and gets wet, it could possibly mean it reaches the metal. If It also was deep enough that the epoxy were gone, it could still mean problems, but sealing over the lacquer is a good idea against potential problems and it a little more insurance if the paint layer got scratched (at least I believe this would be the case). Hopefully others chime in with their opinions as well.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
I believe i am going to take the car back to the metal and start over. Which type of sealer should I use? Once the car is covered with the sealer do I start to fill all the low spots or should it be done before the sealer is sprayed? Should I use a fine sand paper before I put the primer on or only sand the primer and not the sealer? Does anyone offer a sealer primer kit? I know its alot of questions but its my first time,and I want to learn about it as much as i can thanks
 

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epoxy primer is a sealer. I suggest you read through some old threads, as there is a lot of information in them that will answer a lot of your questions. Once you got it back down to bare metal, epoxy prime it. Any bodyfiller work can be done over the epoxy, with out sanding if within the epoxy's time window, or after scuffing it with 180 if the epoxy is past its window. The bodywork could technically be done either way, applying over ground metal and when done then epoxy prime. But IMO as well as many others, epoxy priming first and then filler over is the best way, epoxy protects, and has good adhesion to metal and fillers good adhesion to epoxy. You may want to pound out any large dents or do any metal patch work if required on a panel first though before spraying down the first round of epoxy. Once body filler is sanded and straight, go back and apply more epoxy over bare metal and the filler. If there are a lot of baremetal spots and filler work, you may want to apply a few more coats on the whole car.

Once you get it stripped back down, spray epoxy on the metal as soon as possible to keep it from flash rusting. Once it is epoxied, it will protect the metal just fine. You may want strip a few panels at a time then epoxy them. This will break the work up a little bit so you are not trying to do much at once, as well as allow you to get metal protected with epoxy without it sitting unprimed for a long time. Good to hear you are going to take the steps to make it right. Read through a bunch of threads on epoxy and filler and stick around awhile. There are many guys here who can set you straight to doing a good long lasting job, and it all starts with the foundation, where you are at now.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
kenseth17 said:
epoxy primer is a sealer. I suggest you read through some old threads, as there is a lot of information in them that will answer a lot of your questions. Once you got it back down to bare metal, epoxy prime it. Any bodyfiller work can be done over the epoxy, with out sanding if within the epoxy's time window, or after scuffing it with 180 if the epoxy is past its window. The bodywork could technically be done either way, applying over ground metal and when done then epoxy prime. But IMO as well as many others, epoxy priming first and then filler over is the best way, epoxy protects, and has good adhesion to metal and fillers good adhesion to epoxy. You may want to pound out any large dents or do any metal patch work if required on a panel first though before spraying down the first round of epoxy. Once body filler is sanded and straight, go back and apply more epoxy over bare metal and the filler. If there are a lot of baremetal spots and filler work, you may want to apply a few more coats on the whole car.

Once you get it stripped back down, spray epoxy on the metal as soon as possible to keep it from flash rusting. Once it is epoxied, it will protect the metal just fine. You may want strip a few panels at a time then epoxy them. This will break the work up a little bit so you are not trying to do much at once, as well as allow you to get metal protected with epoxy without it sitting unprimed for a long time. Good to hear you are going to take the steps to make it right. Read through a bunch of threads on epoxy and filler and stick around awhile. There are many guys here who can set you straight to doing a good long lasting job, and it all starts with the foundation, where you are at now.
Thanks you dont know how much I appreciate the info
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Ok one more question, which color should I use? I want to paint the car midnight metalic blue or does the epoxy color matter? Then what color of urethane primer should I use. I found a kit of epoxy primer ,but its black. I believe I could get grey I was told it was top of the line. Its made but Kustom paints
 

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I think black would be fine for a midnight blue. The only primer color that is going to matter is the one you do your final primer coats (as long as its not sanded through in a bunch of spots showing another color of primer in a bunch of spots) or if sealing the one you seal with.
 

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kenseth17 said:
epoxy primer is a sealer. I suggest you read through some old threads, as there is a lot of information in them that will answer a lot of your questions. Once you got it back down to bare metal, epoxy prime it. Any bodyfiller work can be done over the epoxy, with out sanding if within the epoxy's time window, or after scuffing it with 180 if the epoxy is past its window. The bodywork could technically be done either way, applying over ground metal and when done then epoxy prime. But IMO as well as many others, epoxy priming first and then filler over is the best way, epoxy protects, and has good adhesion to metal and fillers good adhesion to epoxy. You may want to pound out any large dents or do any metal patch work if required on a panel first though before spraying down the first round of epoxy. Once body filler is sanded and straight, go back and apply more epoxy over bare metal and the filler. If there are a lot of baremetal spots and filler work, you may want to apply a few more coats on the whole car.

Once you get it stripped back down, spray epoxy on the metal as soon as possible to keep it from flash rusting. Once it is epoxied, it will protect the metal just fine. You may want strip a few panels at a time then epoxy them. This will break the work up a little bit so you are not trying to do much at once, as well as allow you to get metal protected with epoxy without it sitting unprimed for a long time. Good to hear you are going to take the steps to make it right. Read through a bunch of threads on epoxy and filler and stick around awhile. There are many guys here who can set you straight to doing a good long lasting job, and it all starts with the foundation, where you are at now.
this is the proceedure I learned in autobody school wish I new it be4 I sprayed my whole truck with some FREE laquer primer, but the body is still in need of a thorough going over. When I redid the bed and got it to bare metal I did start to go to epoxy primer. from having done one fender to bare metal only to find it in surface rust but rust a short time later. good luck my whole truck will be torn apart in time. Ed ke6bnl
 
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