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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Ok I have a pontaic 455 heads 6x the machine shop says I need to reseat the valves with new guides I never heard of this but I don't know every thing and wondering how true is this or are they trying to take advantage. My machanic mentor says it bs. The bill to due this is enough to buy used bare pontaic aluminum heads soooo Iam not realy buying it. Oh and its Car Quest. any help would be great!
 

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My guess is, if the guides had a lot of wear then the valve doesn`t land squarely on the seat so it will need to be reseated. Also if the valves were mixed up and not bagged in the order they came out then you have to reseat them.
 

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boggla500 said:
Ok I have a pontaic 455 heads 6x the machine shop says I need to reseat the valves with new guides
IMO, you need the valves/seats done any time you reline the guides.

are they trying to take advantage. My machanic mentor says it bs.
OK, then how does your mentor plan on doing things? Tell me he's gonna lap them in. :rolleyes:

I don't know anything about Car Quest, but I don't think they are telling you anything wrong, per se. Their prices, however, might be another thing- but as long as you have talked this over BEFORE they started work, you are fine. If they've not yet started, call around and see what the going rate is elsewhere.
 

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boggla500 said:
Ok I have a pontaic 455 heads 6x the machine shop says I need to reseat the valves with new guides I never heard of this but I don't know every thing and wondering how true is this or are they trying to take advantage. My machanic mentor says it bs. The bill to due this is enough to buy used bare pontaic aluminum heads soooo Iam not realy buying it. Oh and its Car Quest. any help would be great!
The valve seats are machined with reference to the guide. Typical guide repairs don't take into consideration the location nor angle the original guide had with the seat. The typical guide repair starts with the guide in what-ever shape its in and either:
1) reams it oversize for a larger stem valve

2) reams it oversize and presses a tubular guide into the hole to restore the original valve stem size.

3) runs a knurler thru the original guide to expand the material, then a reamer is passed thru to size the hole for the valve stem.

You will note that all of these processes never use anything other than the original guide hole to locate the rebuild or repair of the guide. Since the tools used are not guided in 3 dimensional space, especially with small, fast and dirty shops. So these set ups take the path of least resistance thru a worn guide, thus there is no way to assure the guide is located either in the center of the existing seat nor aligned to the seat at a 90 degree angle. This requires that the seats be re-shot to insure that they are concentric and at right angles to the guide.

Bogie
 

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I get this all the time, especially from the kids that buy those"bargain" camel back Chevies for $300.00 then find out the forty plus year old heads are crap.

Replacement guide work is usually done from the original OEM guide as previously stated. Reality sets in when you find that heat, wear, unleaded gas and all the other things that can happen to engine parts does it best to the guides. On a well used engine the guide wear will physically move the centerline of the valve seat. Even if the guide were replaced on the original centerline. The worn seat would not be correct.

Then you get into the case of a Big Block Chevy for example. That has replaceable guides as manufactured. If you replace these in the shop you will find the seats aren't even close. This is because the factory uses semi-finished guides and finishes them with a "gang" reamer setup that does all the guides at once. The bores are never in the center of the guide. All replacement guides use centered bores.

ANY guide replacement work= Seat work..... I pray for you if you use lapping compound on modern engines!!
 

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wow i learned some things here


good thread

never really thought about valve stem and seat alignment issues before really

im not a machinist nor do i ever work on heads but its good to learn info like this.

interesting.
 

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heads

Not to be stupid but you need to find a new mentor...

I promise you if the guides needed replaced the valve job is junk. Even if the guides were installed exactly in the same location, the valve job still need's done. It would be like installing a new set of brake rotors and re-using the old worn out pad on them..


Keith
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
thanx for the help. I will keep it all in mind the reason for junk valve guides is due to house fire and water and sitting not because of a problem in the motor. Yes foke its been checked for cracks and the works no problem there they weren't in the brunt of the fire any way soo It didn't effect it any besides the guides.
 

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boggla500 said:
thanx for the help. I will keep it all in mind the reason for junk valve guides is due to house fire and water and sitting not because of a problem in the motor. Yes foke its been checked for cracks and the works no problem there they weren't in the brunt of the fire any way soo It didn't effect it any besides the guides.
How did that affect the guides?
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
CORRECTION !!!! sorry fokes but I ment when I said reseat I ment grind new seats Sorry I know they must be reseated but New seat re ground sorry looking forward to new Info once again I apologize
 

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after a fire there's a good chance tht those heads are close to scrap unless you want to spend WAY too much monjey putting them n working condition. Uneven heat quickly followed by uneven blasting with a fire house will really screw up some steel... I've seen twisted Ibeams that resulted from fires, I can only imagine how far off it can put the precision that is needed for engine heads. Scrap 'em and get something better.
 
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