EDIT: "My apologies to those who said there is no 2-4 Solenoid in a 700R4. I'm old, and I like my wine, and I mistyped "solenoid" rather than "servo"... they both start with an "S"... BUT, only one respondent pointed out that I may have mistyped..... oh well..."
I know, thousands of us have had this problem, but this one is weird...I sent this to Dana at ProBuilt, but for some reason, he has not answered nor answered his phone. Does anybody know if he's ok ???
After Dana suggested that I put a gallon of Caterpillar gear fluid in, since the symptoms have all been seemingly due to temperature, hence, the guess was viscosity. The major issue, since the last rebuild, has been the fact that when cold/ambient temperature, it goes into 4th just fine. But as the temperature rises/further driving, the shift point for 4th gear engagement would rise from about 40 to 45 mph, up to 65 mph or so.
Unfortunately, it seemed that the addition of the Cat fluid, there seemed to be no affect. Then, I FINALLY installed the Sonnax 2-4 full blast solenoid. After that I thought everything was fixed.. for a while... it was back to normal.. but then it started again..
SOOOOO, I decided that I had to add cooling, so I bought an 11"x11" cooler, and added it in front of the condenser and piped it in series with the original 5"x11" cooler (under a third pusher fan that I had installed earlier with a fan sequencer to control it. The pusher is the first to come on.....) that I had installed during the original build to triple the cooling effect. Well, then all was perfect and I thought everything was now wonderful.! ! ! (This is covered in the second link below on page 2 of Chapter 2 of the 700R4 rebuild)
maybe 500 miles of driving... all of a sudden, I'm back to the original issue... no 4th after I drive maybe 3 or 4 miles.. good 4th gear till it warms up, but now, the shift point doesn't gradually keep rising the further I drive, all of a sudden, no 4th even up to 70 mph once it warms up. This was just last week after the drag race mentioned below)
So, now, I'm more than frustrated, and thinking I have a "control" issue with the valve body... I have searched and printed three reference drawings to try to figure out the real culprit..
Here is what I'm thinking... which I don't have much confidence in, so I thought you may be able to shed some light on this thing...
By the way, when it DOES go into 4th, it is not "lazy" or slip in any way. When the 2-4 solenoid kicks in, it's a nice firm shift, even with the "old" Corvette servo (later put a Sonnax full kit servo). And I have no issue with the lockup working either. I have a three way switch and rewired the 4th pneumatic switch so that I can control either lockup in 2,3,4, or "stock" lockup in 4th only, or no lockup at all in any gear.
It appears from the drawings that the primary pressure source for the 2-3 solenoid comes from a port just behind the spring in the 4-3 sequencer valve. But it must be triggered by a signal from (initially the action of the 3-4 shift valve, which then triggers the 3-4 relay (part of the same bore as the 4-3 sequencer valve) to throw pressure to the back side of the 2-4 solenoid to engage 4th gear...
Also, I noticed that my shifter had to be nudged a little bit for the neutral safety switch to engage to start, so I thought "OH, the shift linkage is a little bit off and when I'm in "D", maybe it's thinking I'm in "2", or third gear. So I crawled under it for the thousandths time, and it was off by about 3/16", so I moved/adjusted the linkage so that when in "D", it was firmly in the detent position for "D". Made no difference... I also thought that because after driving home on a 200 mile trip, after stopping and then taking off again, 4th gear quit engaging... so I shifted to "N", then pulled the shifter back very carefully and slowly into "D", and it shifted into 4th the rest of the way home.. Is it possible that the Manual Valve is leaking??.. But this last week, I tried that again, and it didn't make it work.. so I don't know if it was just another "coincidence" or not...
Here is something strange.. one evening last week, I happened to pull up next to a (probably one of those knock-off kit cars) Shelby Cobra's.. well, I couldn't resist.. so at the next red light, we had a little race.. and I waxed his asssss !! And after that kinda HARD race, that's when it then refused to go into 4th again... may just be a coincidence,... but.... too weird ....
And finally, it seems that when I make a change, it works fine for a while, then returns to the problem again..
I'm starting to think that it's not a problem with viscosity at all, but something getting stuck with "expansion" of some damned valve somewhere...perhaps getting stuck ... or a leak.. hell, I don't know....
Here are the three drawings down below the links....that I'm referring to...
So before I tear into it again, I'd kinda need to know what to look for...
Thanks, guys..
Here are links to my website for more background on the transmission..
Chapter 1- back a few years ago...
The 700R4 Transmission, Chapter 1 - 49FordCoupe
Chapter 2, after mechanical failure (where you helped me with parts and tips)...BE SURE TO GO TO PAGE 2 OF THIS GALLERY FOR THE LATEST
The 700R4 Transmission, Chapter 2 - 49FordCoupe
And finally, my "home page" of my website to see the entire catalog of the building of the car..(mostly non-related to my current problems...
PaulsPics
ᐧ
I know, thousands of us have had this problem, but this one is weird...I sent this to Dana at ProBuilt, but for some reason, he has not answered nor answered his phone. Does anybody know if he's ok ???
After Dana suggested that I put a gallon of Caterpillar gear fluid in, since the symptoms have all been seemingly due to temperature, hence, the guess was viscosity. The major issue, since the last rebuild, has been the fact that when cold/ambient temperature, it goes into 4th just fine. But as the temperature rises/further driving, the shift point for 4th gear engagement would rise from about 40 to 45 mph, up to 65 mph or so.
Unfortunately, it seemed that the addition of the Cat fluid, there seemed to be no affect. Then, I FINALLY installed the Sonnax 2-4 full blast solenoid. After that I thought everything was fixed.. for a while... it was back to normal.. but then it started again..
SOOOOO, I decided that I had to add cooling, so I bought an 11"x11" cooler, and added it in front of the condenser and piped it in series with the original 5"x11" cooler (under a third pusher fan that I had installed earlier with a fan sequencer to control it. The pusher is the first to come on.....) that I had installed during the original build to triple the cooling effect. Well, then all was perfect and I thought everything was now wonderful.! ! ! (This is covered in the second link below on page 2 of Chapter 2 of the 700R4 rebuild)
maybe 500 miles of driving... all of a sudden, I'm back to the original issue... no 4th after I drive maybe 3 or 4 miles.. good 4th gear till it warms up, but now, the shift point doesn't gradually keep rising the further I drive, all of a sudden, no 4th even up to 70 mph once it warms up. This was just last week after the drag race mentioned below)
So, now, I'm more than frustrated, and thinking I have a "control" issue with the valve body... I have searched and printed three reference drawings to try to figure out the real culprit..
Here is what I'm thinking... which I don't have much confidence in, so I thought you may be able to shed some light on this thing...
By the way, when it DOES go into 4th, it is not "lazy" or slip in any way. When the 2-4 solenoid kicks in, it's a nice firm shift, even with the "old" Corvette servo (later put a Sonnax full kit servo). And I have no issue with the lockup working either. I have a three way switch and rewired the 4th pneumatic switch so that I can control either lockup in 2,3,4, or "stock" lockup in 4th only, or no lockup at all in any gear.
It appears from the drawings that the primary pressure source for the 2-3 solenoid comes from a port just behind the spring in the 4-3 sequencer valve. But it must be triggered by a signal from (initially the action of the 3-4 shift valve, which then triggers the 3-4 relay (part of the same bore as the 4-3 sequencer valve) to throw pressure to the back side of the 2-4 solenoid to engage 4th gear...
Also, I noticed that my shifter had to be nudged a little bit for the neutral safety switch to engage to start, so I thought "OH, the shift linkage is a little bit off and when I'm in "D", maybe it's thinking I'm in "2", or third gear. So I crawled under it for the thousandths time, and it was off by about 3/16", so I moved/adjusted the linkage so that when in "D", it was firmly in the detent position for "D". Made no difference... I also thought that because after driving home on a 200 mile trip, after stopping and then taking off again, 4th gear quit engaging... so I shifted to "N", then pulled the shifter back very carefully and slowly into "D", and it shifted into 4th the rest of the way home.. Is it possible that the Manual Valve is leaking??.. But this last week, I tried that again, and it didn't make it work.. so I don't know if it was just another "coincidence" or not...
Here is something strange.. one evening last week, I happened to pull up next to a (probably one of those knock-off kit cars) Shelby Cobra's.. well, I couldn't resist.. so at the next red light, we had a little race.. and I waxed his asssss !! And after that kinda HARD race, that's when it then refused to go into 4th again... may just be a coincidence,... but.... too weird ....
And finally, it seems that when I make a change, it works fine for a while, then returns to the problem again..
I'm starting to think that it's not a problem with viscosity at all, but something getting stuck with "expansion" of some damned valve somewhere...perhaps getting stuck ... or a leak.. hell, I don't know....
Here are the three drawings down below the links....that I'm referring to...
So before I tear into it again, I'd kinda need to know what to look for...
Thanks, guys..
Here are links to my website for more background on the transmission..
Chapter 1- back a few years ago...
The 700R4 Transmission, Chapter 1 - 49FordCoupe
Chapter 2, after mechanical failure (where you helped me with parts and tips)...BE SURE TO GO TO PAGE 2 OF THIS GALLERY FOR THE LATEST
The 700R4 Transmission, Chapter 2 - 49FordCoupe
And finally, my "home page" of my website to see the entire catalog of the building of the car..(mostly non-related to my current problems...
PaulsPics
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