Holley bought'em out. BG thought it got a bad rep before from guys simply too lazy to learn how to tune them but not that Holley is in the fold BG products get to become REAL junk,, now thats stepping up in the world.

 

Holley bought'em out. BG thought it got a bad rep before from guys simply too lazy to learn how to tune them but not that Holley is in the fold BG products get to become REAL junk,, now thats stepping up in the world.

Holley purchased BG from Bankruptcy, Barry Grant himself was his own worst problem.

===========================

And BG could use some Holley wisdom! :mwink: :mwink:

The only and the largest headache I had working for GM was Barry Grant carbs on the crate engines. THEY (BG) WERE A PAIN IN THE *** TO DEAL WITH! They expected people who purchase crate engine for a no hassle deal to be able to make major changes to the carb. When most knew basics and that why they are crate engine customers!
It was a bad deal all around, at the time customer service from BG was hideous.

Al

 

In my experience some of the BG stuff had to be worked on, sure. But, it's nothing compaired to how many times I've gotten brand new holleys out of the box and parts are missing, thats gotten to be a holley trade mark.
Then we add in plastic throttle shaft bushings that don't cost a cent to make but you used to couldn't get replacements for them so when they went bad which was usually within a year you had to throw the carb aside until you could find another throttle body. Then I remember how many times I seen the holley base plates break which every time was due to the person installing it but it sure made it easy considering it was made of pot metal.
What's kept Holley in business? three things: They're reputation as a race carb from way back, Ease of tuning, and last, market dominance.
I started fooling with Holleys in the early 90's, it didnt take long before I realized they had the poorest quality control of any company I ever seen.
It was that, and other reasons why I went back to what I started with, a Quadrajet.

 

I love my BG 750 Speed Demon.

 

Most people create their own problems. If they're not able to modify and tune a particular brand then they should be avoided by those people. Those who can't tune a Holley-type carb have three options: LEARN, PAY SOMEONE, or buy a Q-jet.

 

Or edelbrock- the almost idiot proof carb.

 

Never said a word about having any issue tuning them. Who can't tune a holley?

 

They´re sooo purty too. :thumbup:

 

Please don't post your personal rants in the tech forums. Moving to the Lounge.

 

They´re sooo purty too. :thumbup:

It looks more like some sort of outer space shoe than a mechanical part of a car.
I have had 3 of them through the years, and didn't like a one. They were all soggy compared to the Holley. Maybe they respond well to some tweaks. But, out of the box...not impressed

 

Holley purchased BG from Bankruptcy, Barry Grant himself was his own worst problem.

===========================

And BG could use some Holley wisdom! :mwink: :mwink:

The only and the largest headache I had working for GM was Barry Grant carbs on the crate engines. THEY (BG) WERE A PAIN IN THE *** TO DEAL WITH! They expected people who purchase crate engine for a no hassle deal to be able to make major changes to the carb. When most knew basics and that why they are crate engine customers!
It was a bad deal all around, at the time customer service from BG was hideous.

Al

Coming from a non expert opinion on the matter of demons :evil:

What I dont get is why would the new release take the BG name if BG=CRAP? not saying it is or is not crap. His name is good for something, he is making out ok on that deal, good for him.

And IMO Folks do need to do their homework, you dont just buy a crate motor and plug it in and expect to use it like a USB drive or something do you? It was most likely un-educated (on product), tool-less, buyers doing all the complaining.

I never ran the carbs, yeah they are slick looking, but like most holley gender carbs they like WOT and that is what works for some applications I hear.

 

Coming from a non expert opinion on the matter of demons :evil:

What I dont get is why would the new release take the BG name if BG=CRAP? not saying it is or is not crap. His name is good for something, he is making out ok on that deal, good for him.

And IMO Folks do need to do their homework, you dont just buy a crate motor and plug it in and expect to use it like a USB drive or something do you? It was most likely un-educated (on product), tool-less, buyers doing all the complaining.

I never ran the carbs, yeah they are slick looking, but like most holley gender carbs they like WOT and that is what works for some applications I hear.

The BG brand has value and a market place.
BG has several brands, DeMon, Rosh Filters, Triple D Injection & Nitrous works.

=======================================================
Now BG service. This in a nut shell is why he went bank rump.

========================================================

If a installer can make major changes to a carburater he can most likley rebuild or build his own engine.

Engines are not plug and play and even the crate engine buisness and customers know this.

Put yourself in a customers shoes.

You just purchased a 7500.00 dollar ZZ4 complete engine package, GMPP crate engine. Your having off line issues. You call BG and they talk to you like your stupid or incompetent. (I have personal heard these calls.) How would you as a customer who purchased your engine from GMPP and not BG feel at this point??.

How would you feel about your hard earned money being spent?

To say the customer is stupid for expecting plug and play is not founded.
It's the same attitude as BG.

Most problems were with the ZZ4 complete assembly's, they were changed back to Holley long before others. And once changed, the complaints stopped. Also when there was a carb problem Holley handled it very professionally. Barry Grant himself to this day thinks GM shafted him. He shafted himself. And in the end walked out. literally walked out.

Summit stopped carrying his brands years ago because of Customer service and return issues.

You can have a great product, but when you treat customers like crap, your business life will be short. As we have proof.


Al

 

To say the customer is stupid for expecting plug and play is not founded.
It's the same attitude as BG.

You are correct customer service counts.

I did not use the word stupid. Joe buyer expecting plug and play is reading about stuff, Joe buyer making things run for himself = hotrodder = realist. If you know your local speed shop dealer that would help. If its on-line then you already for fitted service to some degree IMO.

I hope that they have a good run on those new BG Demons or what ever they label them as.

 

I had no personal experience with BG but a lot of unsatisfied people came to the surface on car forums when they went under. Seems they had some serious quality control issues and lousy customer service, at least towards the end.
I'm not Holleys greatest fan but when I needed a baseplate for a 390, I called engineering and they had me a new one out within a week for $65. I was very impressed.
I figured someone would buy BG and continue building them, glad to see it's happened.

 

Jegs continued to carry BG after Summit stopped. I'm not in the loop at Summit to know why they stopped carrying BG, but for whatever reason that decision was made, it had to have hurt BG's bottom line, being as how Summit is #1 in their field. At that point I stopped considering BG as a viable option for a performance carb. If Summit couldn't- for whatever reason- deal w/BG, I figured I'd do no better if there was a problem.

On the other hand, there was a guy who used to post here as "Tech@BG" or something like that. He offered help and advice and AFAIK no one from any other carb company offered help that way.

BTW, I'm not a BG fan. Nor am I a detractor. I tend to look at carbs differently than maybe the majority of guys do. None are ever as good as they can be, all can be improved on. BG is no different in this regard than any other carb. Their problems started early w/poor QC/QA- I personally do not know if that was compounded by poor communications by the tech lines/customer service departments. But to say Barry Grant caused all his problems, to me, is a stretch. Sure, he's responsible for what goes on in his company, and ultimately the decisions come down to him. But EVERY person in a company has an effect on the product. EVERY supervisor has the responsibility to run their department as best they can. So if there was a problem related to BG himself, I'd say it was who he chose to help run things rather than his demeanor per se.

Cheaper to buy a used core for a baseplate than buying NEW IMO. $165.00 for a 4160 List 8007 baseplate is ridiculous.

 

Anyone who bought a BG carb from Summit and had trouble getting it tuned in returned it on the "it´s broke" ticket.
Summit refunded their money and the carb went back to BG.
BG plopped it on one of their test motors and it worked just fine.
So now BG have a good carb on their hands but it´s a "used" carb. ain:
So they stopped having Summit carry their product.

 

They´re sooo purty too. :thumbup:

On the other hand, there was a guy who used to post here as "Tech@BG" or something like that. He offered help and advice and AFAIK no one from any other carb company offered help that way.

the only thing I can add to this thread, is that I agree
the carbs do look good
I thought that it was cool, that tech@bg was so helpful, to so many people


I have never used one, and have nothing to say good or bad, about them
but based on those two things, I sure would have given them a try :thumbup:

 

Volume has a lot to do w/it, IMHO. I suspect just as many Holley carbs were returned as BG's. But Summit probably sold 50 Holley carbs to a single BG carb. That means Holley could afford to 'eat' more returned carbs than BG.

Add the fact that Holley openly sells remanufactured carbs and that means Holley gets hurt a lot less on returned carbs than BG.

 

Add the fact that Holley openly sells remanufactured carbs and that means Holley gets hurt a lot less on returned carbs than BG.

very good point :thumbup:

just blow them off, some new gaskets, and back in a box :evil:

 

In my experience some of the BG stuff had to be worked on, sure. But, it's nothing compaired to how many times I've gotten brand new holleys out of the box and parts are missing, thats gotten to be a holley trade mark.
Then we add in plastic throttle shaft bushings that don't cost a cent to make but you used to couldn't get replacements for them so when they went bad which was usually within a year you had to throw the carb aside until you could find another throttle body. Then I remember how many times I seen the holley base plates break which every time was due to the person installing it but it sure made it easy considering it was made of pot metal.
What's kept Holley in business? three things: They're reputation as a race carb from way back, Ease of tuning, and last, market dominance.
I started fooling with Holleys in the early 90's, it didnt take long before I realized they had the poorest quality control of any company I ever seen.
It was that, and other reasons why I went back to what I started with, a Quadrajet.

Whats kept Holley in business is a good reputation.
just look at all the copy cats like Quick fuel, Proform, Etc Etc! If we all had the same experience as you (Which I dont doubt you had) They would have folded years ago.


The Teflon bushings dont usually go bad unless some one puts too strong a return spring on the linkage! Putting to much pressure on the shaft! Even something this insignificant is part of tuning I never had problems ordeing these. If its a carb rebuild and you order the right kit their in it. Its funny Holly tests all its carbs, thats why they have a little gas in em when you take em out of the box. Unless its been on a shelf for a long time. Ive seen part store employees and warehouse employees fired for steeling parts off things or steeling the whole thing.Your problem may be with a employee in the chain of your delivery's! I'de change suppliers!

Sounds like Holley doesn't like you at all ain: I checked my bills and I put on 24 Holley's this year all different sizes (from street to full 0ut race) didnt have any problems Except for some special tuning !! And Im not saying you didnt! but Ive had my own performance shop for over 28 years and the only problems I ever had I can count on one hand !! Like the man said "Who cant tune a Holley" I also have had no troubles with, Carters, Motorcraft, rochesters, webbers, Proform, and a few more except for normal tune ins>
But some of the carbs I have had problems with are: the webber made edelbrocks (carter copies), Kendigs, , Quick flow (but I only installed one of these : not enough for me to make an opinion on all their products). Barry Grants, were fine carbs at first He should be proud of that, I liked them! I dont know what happened but they slowly lost their luster to me (I found fileings left in bowls, Wrong jets, bad power valves, even found a cigarette but in a bowl that held the float up ( disgruntled employee I guess), or a jet that had no hole in it,or a base plate I had to flatten because it rocked on the intake, I dont blame him you blame the people that did work for him!! Its too bad!They were at one time a very good carb. Ive probably installed 50 of these since they hit the market except for the inline 4s. He wasnt a copy cat he was innovative and he made a product that worked and was beautiful !

I dont use Quadrajets on performance builds only stock replacements Its a very good carb! So where thermoquads! I think I remember G.M, Ford Etc Using Holleys : remember the 950 Holley 3 barrels When you put your foot down!! they'd sound like a jet & pull the freckles off you face!!

Im not pushing any products or have I meant to offend any body If I did I apologize! I dont need to debate my statements they all come from personnel experience and are my opinions no debating will change them. :thumbup:

Jester

 

Most people create their own problems. If they're not able to modify and tune a particular brand then they should be avoided by those people. Those who can't tune a Holley-type carb have three options: LEARN, PAY SOMEONE, or buy a Q-jet.

I think you made a very good statement there :thumbup:

Jester

 

Anyone who bought a BG carb from Summit and had trouble getting it tuned in returned it on the "it´s broke" ticket.
Summit refunded their money and the carb went back to BG.
BG plopped it on one of their test motors and it worked just fine.
So now BG have a good carb on their hands but it´s a "used" carb. ain:
So they stopped having Summit carry their product.

You hit the nail on the head! :thumbup: I have had more customers coming in when B.G.'s first hit the market saying this doesnt work right I put my edelbrock back on and it runs fine! And I put the B.G. on and with a simple turn of a few screws it runs great. If they dont know anything about carbs except bolting them on and setting the idle they shouldnt buy the things they should take it to a guy that knows what hes doing!(so many people bought them becouse they were sooooo pretty)! He should of made them uglier

Jester

 

I think I remember G.M, Ford Etc Using Holleys

Yep, as did Mopar.

And Ford and Mopar used Q-jets.

 

my chrysler newyorker 3.5 has two holley throttle bodies as well as my 3.9 Dakota truck,it has one Holley thorttle body :thumbup:

 

You have to tune the carburator to the specific demands of the engine you r building,it doesnt matter who makes the carb!
How can you expect any manufacturer to know the specific jetting needs,power valve,air bleeds etc u need.
Its kinda like setting a distributor for a chevy, they dont no what timing curve to put in,its up to the tuner.
Ive had my share of tuning headaches with all kind of carbs!
Takes a lot of work to make them right
I liked the Holley 3 barrels wish they still made them!