Any particular type of hydraulic Roller Lifter that I must use for this block? I read that I needed a +.300 tall lifter ????
I was looking at Howards 91164N
I was looking at Howards 91164N
bigmac73
you bought a superior block to make a bigger more powerful engine? Buy a solid cam. The pressurised solids are pretty good.
Yes the Dart SHP uses the '87-95 factory roller lifters, or if you want link-bar type then they are +300" taller than old Gen 1 retro-fit type.
Right from Dart web page for the SHP block...
"• Uses + .300” tall stock 87-95 roller lifters."
You don't have to use link-bar lifters...but the SHP block is set up for the factory style rollers if you want to take advantage of that., if you want to use the factory spider and guides.
I would be using a better lifter than the Howards you've picked, that is their base level lifter.
Right from Dart web page for the SHP block...
"• Uses + .300” tall stock 87-95 roller lifters."
You don't have to use link-bar lifters...but the SHP block is set up for the factory style rollers if you want to take advantage of that., if you want to use the factory spider and guides.
I would be using a better lifter than the Howards you've picked, that is their base level lifter.
Clay Smith Engineering 125-5315 Clay Smith Cams Factory Replacement Hydraulic Roller Lifters | Summit Racing
Free Shipping - Clay Smith Cams Factory Replacement Hydraulic Roller Lifters with qualifying orders of $99. Shop Lifters at Summit Racing.
www.summitracing.com
Eric,
this lifter using the stock spider and dogbones? seems a much cheaper option that the link bar set up.
also can i run the factory set up with the old style cam shaft, I do not have a step nose cam.
You can use the oem lifters with the spider tray with a retrofit hydraulic roller camshaft but you have to make sure you have to use the matching timing chain that goes with a 85 and earlier style camshaft face that is flat with no step on the nose of the camshaft. They changed the bolt pattern to be more inward on the 86 and up step nose camshafts since they use a cam retainer plate. You will also have to use a heavy duty timing cover and also a cam button to keep the camshaft from pushing forward.
If you have not gotten your cam yet I would recommend the step nose style since you can use a cam retaining plate and not have to worry about setting up the clearance on the camshaft button. If you use a retrofit style hydraulic roller camshaft you have to set the end play on the camshaft to be between .005 and no more then .010 of end play and its easy to do but you have to have a strong enough timing cover to not flex under load if its a steel cover your using. An aluminum one will eliminate that one.
Also there are several styles of cam buttons you can get as well. There is the roller version which uses a locking plate with the bolts to hold it in place or you can use a nylon cam button or an aluminum one. I have used the retrofit style before in an original GM block and since it does not except oem roller lifters on a two piece rear main seal block unlike the Dart shp which takes everything except retrofit style roller lifters, it was a pain getting the right end play setup as having to take the cover on an off and measuring this and that. Its easy but some what time consuming but still doable.
It is not hard but it is something that if you have the option to bypass for the better oem style with the step nose and retaining plate design its the best way to go and the cost of the camshaft is no difference between the styles. I myself have read and seen great reviews for the Howards link bar lifters you listed above and for anything 230@50 or less duration and 550 lift or below and less then 6500 rpm, I would not think twice about using them with a set of springs with 130 pound seat pressure and 300 open pressure and a 300 plus pound spring rate.
If your going to use a hydraulic cam with 230@50 or more duration and will be seeing a lot of constant high rpm rates and more spring pressure then what I posted above and will see a lot of track time then I would recommend the Howards link bar lifters that I don't have the part number for right now that has the .750 sized wheel and has a stronger forged lifter body and is around $900 or more the last time I saw the price. They can handle a lot more constant higher rpm and also a lot more spring pressure on the lifter itself and is more durable but for an everyday street cruiser the ones you listed will be more then good enough for the just occasional throttle romp.
I used the Howards oem lifter set up 91113 once which runs around $265 on a small block 350 setup with a set of Dart shp 180cc aluminum heads and with a lunati vodoo hydraulic roller camshaft 270/278 219/227@50 515/530 lift and all I did was run it on the street and no track time and I ran as set of dual valve springs that are what comp cams uses for there extreme energy hydraulic roller cams and I had revved mine up to 6200 rpms a few times and everything was spot on and never any issues. The thing with the factory style oem roller lifters is they are limited to lift of about .530 lift on safest max amount using a 1.5 ratio rocker arm.
The reason being is once the lift on the camshaft gets more lobe lift to be higher then .530 using the 1.5 ratio rocker arm is because it will start to have a smaller base circle on the camshaft in order to get more lift off the lobe while also keeping the lobe of the camshaft below the area of the camshaft that is ran on the cam bearings. Once the base of the camshaft gets to be to small it will allow the lifter to drop down much more on the smaller base circle of the cam because of the higher lift on the lobe peak, thus it will allow it sometimes drop to the point that the bog bone retainer that the spider tray holds down will allow the lifter to fall out and then end up spinning in the lifter bore causing failure.
So you must be aware of that. If your using the link bar lifters you don't have to worry about that but if you use a cam with less then .530 lift you can use the oem style with good results in a street cruiser.
If you have not gotten your cam yet I would recommend the step nose style since you can use a cam retaining plate and not have to worry about setting up the clearance on the camshaft button. If you use a retrofit style hydraulic roller camshaft you have to set the end play on the camshaft to be between .005 and no more then .010 of end play and its easy to do but you have to have a strong enough timing cover to not flex under load if its a steel cover your using. An aluminum one will eliminate that one.
Also there are several styles of cam buttons you can get as well. There is the roller version which uses a locking plate with the bolts to hold it in place or you can use a nylon cam button or an aluminum one. I have used the retrofit style before in an original GM block and since it does not except oem roller lifters on a two piece rear main seal block unlike the Dart shp which takes everything except retrofit style roller lifters, it was a pain getting the right end play setup as having to take the cover on an off and measuring this and that. Its easy but some what time consuming but still doable.
It is not hard but it is something that if you have the option to bypass for the better oem style with the step nose and retaining plate design its the best way to go and the cost of the camshaft is no difference between the styles. I myself have read and seen great reviews for the Howards link bar lifters you listed above and for anything 230@50 or less duration and 550 lift or below and less then 6500 rpm, I would not think twice about using them with a set of springs with 130 pound seat pressure and 300 open pressure and a 300 plus pound spring rate.
If your going to use a hydraulic cam with 230@50 or more duration and will be seeing a lot of constant high rpm rates and more spring pressure then what I posted above and will see a lot of track time then I would recommend the Howards link bar lifters that I don't have the part number for right now that has the .750 sized wheel and has a stronger forged lifter body and is around $900 or more the last time I saw the price. They can handle a lot more constant higher rpm and also a lot more spring pressure on the lifter itself and is more durable but for an everyday street cruiser the ones you listed will be more then good enough for the just occasional throttle romp.
I used the Howards oem lifter set up 91113 once which runs around $265 on a small block 350 setup with a set of Dart shp 180cc aluminum heads and with a lunati vodoo hydraulic roller camshaft 270/278 219/227@50 515/530 lift and all I did was run it on the street and no track time and I ran as set of dual valve springs that are what comp cams uses for there extreme energy hydraulic roller cams and I had revved mine up to 6200 rpms a few times and everything was spot on and never any issues. The thing with the factory style oem roller lifters is they are limited to lift of about .530 lift on safest max amount using a 1.5 ratio rocker arm.
The reason being is once the lift on the camshaft gets more lobe lift to be higher then .530 using the 1.5 ratio rocker arm is because it will start to have a smaller base circle on the camshaft in order to get more lift off the lobe while also keeping the lobe of the camshaft below the area of the camshaft that is ran on the cam bearings. Once the base of the camshaft gets to be to small it will allow the lifter to drop down much more on the smaller base circle of the cam because of the higher lift on the lobe peak, thus it will allow it sometimes drop to the point that the bog bone retainer that the spider tray holds down will allow the lifter to fall out and then end up spinning in the lifter bore causing failure.
So you must be aware of that. If your using the link bar lifters you don't have to worry about that but if you use a cam with less then .530 lift you can use the oem style with good results in a street cruiser.
As i listed above, the comp roller cam (12-419-8) has been installed with thrust button and timing cover that is part of the deluxe shortblock option. This engine is strickly street only.
I have an 880 roller block with the cam assembly still intact in the garage that i picked up a few years ago, So i can use the dog bones and lifter hold down tray from that.
I have an 880 roller block with the cam assembly still intact in the garage that i picked up a few years ago, So i can use the dog bones and lifter hold down tray from that.
Yes you can use the GM lifter tray and dog bones as that is what the Dart SHP block was made to use along with a lot of other factory parts form the small block chevy. Its basically the best of both worlds when it comes to the 4 different versions they have. The two piece rear main seal block which I use has the best of both worlds and has the two piece rear main seal and the 80 to 85 oil pan passenger side dipstick, but it like all the blocks combines the 86 and up oem roller setup configuration cast into the block the same as the factory blocks have like the 880.
I use the two piece rear seal which I know defeats the purpose of using the one piece rear main seal style which is better but I go with the two piece rear seal as its somewhat easier for some parts and a few more options vs the one piece rear main seal which on some things cost more depending on what it is for the part. The cost is not much but for me it was the options for oil pan and other factors.
You can use the roller lifter parts with your cam. I would be vary careful with the .540 life on the exhaust side of things. I have read folks running more then .530 lift before using oem roller lifters and having no problems but the .530 is the recommended safety limit on that style of lifter setup vs a link bar setup style.
I use the two piece rear seal which I know defeats the purpose of using the one piece rear main seal style which is better but I go with the two piece rear seal as its somewhat easier for some parts and a few more options vs the one piece rear main seal which on some things cost more depending on what it is for the part. The cost is not much but for me it was the options for oil pan and other factors.
You can use the roller lifter parts with your cam. I would be vary careful with the .540 life on the exhaust side of things. I have read folks running more then .530 lift before using oem roller lifters and having no problems but the .530 is the recommended safety limit on that style of lifter setup vs a link bar setup style.
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
