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High compression is back, but how with poor modern fuel?

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1.8K views 6 replies 7 participants last post by  FmrStrtracer  
#1 ·
In the 60's and early 70's, one easy, cheap way for auto companies and private car owners to get more power was to install higher compression pistons. That was possible because the gas was of better quality with higher octane and with lead as an anti-knock compound and lubricant.

Then, in about '73, the government regulations and stiffer insurance standards as well and gas quality dropping led to lower horsepower in cars. Plus, in the early 80's, lead was removed from gas.

So I've read many car magazines where they stated that the simple plan of raising compression is now out(since the 70's and 80's), and if you want to increase engine power, you must do it while maintaining about an 8.5:1 to 9:1 compression ratio. So you had to get your power another way, such as improving cylinder head flow, better cam, power adders, etc.

But if you still owned an older high compression engine, you HAD TO use premium fuel with an octane booster, or racing fuel, and maybe even a bottled lead additive as well. So that deterred most from high compression engines.

According to every magazine I read, you didnt want to exceed about 9:1 or maybe 9.5: at the most. although they even recommended against that. The reason was that you'd likely have detonation problems in the engine, and it would ruin it. I never heard anyone recommending 11:1 or anything higher, unless it was a race car using race fuel! :nono:

But now, I'm reading how newer American engines have 11:1 compression! I certainly have not noticed that gas quality or octane ratings have gotten better or gone up, so how are they able to get away with these high compression ratios without problems like detonation?
 
#3 ·
I think you answered your question here. "So you had to get your power another way, such as improving cylinder head flow, better cam, power adders, etc." Along with the proper fuel injection pulse width, and OBD11 electronic control systems.

It can be done on older vehicles, but like you posted, higher 'racing' fuel, and quality tuning is a must.
 
#4 ·
This is exactly what I am up against now,, I have a 69 Pontiac Bonneville with the 428m 11/1 compression, and the premium fuel does NOTHING to stop the detonation problem,, I have used the premium fuel, all kinds of additives,, and lead substutes stuff.. nothing seems to help..
I have been checking into the Pro Products fuel injections systems,, they talk a great pitch on how good they are ,, just plug and play,,, :rolleyes: but regardless,, I think a fuel injection update would be a worth while investment,
anyone had any reports on a good F/I system,, ? especally the Pro Jection system. http://www.summitracing.com/parts/PFS-70026/
 
#6 ·
The 5.0 in the new Mustangs has 11:1 compression. The engine is rated at 412hp when using 93 octane fuel as recommended by Ford. However, you can safely run 87 octane and Ford says you'll still get 402hp. It's all about computer controls and computer design of the parts themselves. Computers can very precisely control the spark and fuel curves, something carburetors and distributors can't even come close to doing.

Modern computer modeling and design techniques also permit far more efficient and precise designs. Heck, there are factory cylinder heads out these days that are capable of flowing well over 300 cfm. GMs LS7 and Fords new 5.0L cylinder heads flow in the neighborhood of 320 cfm.

Then there's the twin turbo 3.5L V6 you can get in the F-150s now. It's rated at 365hp and 420lb ft at just 2500 rpm. Those are near diesel like numbers from a 213ci gas V6.

And just wait until direct injection starts becoming more common. It's going to allow manufacturers to push those limits even further? 12:1 compression on pump gas may not be that much of a stretch....
 
#7 ·
Bad Rat said:
This is exactly what I am up against now,, I have a 69 Pontiac Bonneville with the 428m 11/1 compression, and the premium fuel does NOTHING to stop the detonation problem,, I have used the premium fuel, all kinds of additives,, and lead substutes stuff.. nothing seems to help..
I have been checking into the Pro Products fuel injections systems,, they talk a great pitch on how good they are ,, just plug and play,,, :rolleyes: but regardless,, I think a fuel injection update would be a worth while investment,
anyone had any reports on a good F/I system,, ? especally the Pro Jection system. http://www.summitracing.com/parts/PFS-70026/
Just switching to FI will not solve your problem, you also need to add the timing curve control, with out it the motor will still detonate.